WTH? A Holton 345 with SIX VALVES?

[the elephant]

No doubt.

I am minimizing my "intended use spectrum" as a last-ditch effort to talk myself out of adding the 6th valve. If, after all that, I still want it then I think I will be happy that it is on the tuba.

Luckily, it won't be very much added weight, being such a short slide and all…

[the elephant]

Some back-of-the-envelope math tells me that

1st valve drops pitch by 200¢
5th valve drops pitch by 250¢
2nd valve drops pitch by 100¢
6th valve drops pitch by 125¢

Low E (or A on an F tuba) 234 is almost always a flat pitch, and 124 and 34 are always sharp. 56-4 should be correct (and is).

124 = 800¢
234 = 900¢
5-24 = 850¢ (low E on Holton right now)
56-4 = 875¢ (low A on Kurath right now)

Interesting.

Not a comment… just… interesting…

[the elephant]

This tuba is winning out over the Yamaha, believe it or not. I am not sure that others would prefer it to an excellent example of a YamaYork, but it seems that *I* do.

Still keeping the Yamaha… for at least a few more years if not for good. I really love it. But this Holton is a real winner for me.

We played a ton of John Williams tonight, with our excellent new Principal Boner and two excellent subs. Also, one of my best friends is a high school band director for a 2A school. His entire marching band is about 35 hard-working kids who put out some high-quality sounds and seriously punch above their weight. He managed to get 15 of them to make the 2+ hour drive from his part of the state down to Jackson for this concert, and they all loved it. He always gets a busload of them to come see us. I love those kids! I think I started working with him and his kids in 2004. I was quite pleased that, when I was packing up to go, I looked up into this sea of friendly faces, all excited to be there, getting to hear all this exciting and familiar symphonic music live.

Our concert hall is down for mold abatement, so the MSO is a pack of musical gypsies right now. We played at a local megachurch with decent acoustics. Despite this, we had a big crowd of about a thousand folks.

It was a great evening… for me, AND the Holton!

Jude Morris, Kyle Dykes, Alex Handley, Wade Rackley. Please note that I am 6'2" tall…


Almost half of the Eupora HS Band came tonight.

[bloke]

Congrats !!!

I've stated several times that the bell of the model 98 Miraphone is exactly the size and taper and length and everything as a Holton 345 bell. I don't know if the Germans copied a 345 bell, but I'm somewhat suspicious.

Yeah, it's B flat and it's rotary and it's 21.2 mm bore in the capillary portion - and none of those things are the same as the 826, but I would pick (and have picked) the instrument that I have over an 826. One of the important reasons is because of the type of sound the bell taper makes but (yeah...) the other things have something to do with it as well.

If a player can support the sound, there are really no better large tuba bell resonance characteristics than those offered by a 345-shaped bell, and I've played/owned quite a few tubas featuring all sorts of variants of that basic size.

I predict that as long as you continue to be a c-length tuba player though, you will go back and forth between those two instruments (826 - 345) as to which is your favorite.

[bloke]

Thanks for the thank, but I did edit it in the midst of your thank.

[York-aholic]

!

Just based on looks, I really prefer the look of a slanted valve set on a 6/4 over the more vertical arrangement. It just looks right to me.

Very nicely put together @the elephant!

[the elephant]

It is from one of those Nirschl-made B&M Symphonics from the late 1980s. Wonderful valves!

[York-aholic]

It is from one of those Nirschl-made B&M Symphonics from the late 1980s. Wonderful valves!

Yep, I’ve got the same on my York 712 that had a shot 3v set on it when I bought it.

Looks like we did something pretty similar for the fourth valve circuit (CC vs BBb lengths not withstanding).

IMG_1550.jpeg (151.11 KiB) Viewed 8732 times

FYI: Miraphone sousaphone top caps fit just fine.

[bloke]

712's are damn good tubas, and the short version is really just about as good (when outfitted with a King valveset)
That's basically what my Holton is, because the Holton and York things (that were only 32 inches tall) were virtually identical. I'm a fan of ALL of those.

The 712's are more sought after, because they are more rare and probably more appealing to the eye...and the 3/4" bore...

[York-aholic]

Yes, agreed. I’d like to have a mid-life crisis soon and buy another 712 in either really, really good shape or in completely restored condition, cost be damned.

Safer and cheaper in the long run than either fast cars or faster women.

[MiBrassFS]

Look at our elephant being a rockstar! So cool! Great to see the yoots being so excited to see live music.

[bloke]

Those really are great pictures of Wade.

For there to be a great picture of me, it would need to be AI.

[the elephant]

I am awaiting the arrival of that Yamaha 641 leadpipe union; then I can finally get back to this project.

Today I restored my two St. Pete rotors to like-new mechanical condition. The damage to the bearings/spindles was not as bad as I had imagined, and now both are in usable condition—after about seven hours of labor. (Rotary valve bearing work can be a real PITA…)

The Miraphone slide tubing and the St. Pete valves fit one other perfectly, without any modifications needed.

What I did today does not photograph worth a darn, so no pics. The cork plate relocation ought to net some interesting photos, though. I will do this work soon.

[the elephant]

Well, after I had cleaned up and packed everything away I thought about stuff and ended up going BACK out there to work some more.

First, I wanted to re-re-reconfirm that not only the 6th valve was oriented and will function as I intend (it does) but also that the old 5th can step in and replace the current (Miraphone) 5th so that I have a nice, matched pair of valves. Since they st adjacent to one another where you can clearly see that they are different brands this would really bug me, and as it turns out, I was correct: the other valve will function identically at the 5th (as it used to BE the 5th).

Happiness…

Then I started looking for adequate rod stock to thread to M3x0.5 to plug the four cork plate screw holes. I scored in a big way, too! I found a rod LREADY THREADED to what I need, with more than enough to use for four plugs.

So I did just that. I will finish the cleanup/prettification after the new holes have been drilled and tapped.

The Yamaha leadpipe union is slated for delivery on Thursday, so that means in six months according to all things Mississippi, but I'll hope for Thursday joy anyway. Once I have that part I can start building this wacko valve section. (Unless the Yamaha part does not fit or is not robust enough. Joe's comment about those unions gives me pause. I guess we all will have to wait and find out.

Funny thing, but that solid brass rod that was nicely turned down in a lathe and then run through a die used to be the linkage rod for the Kurath 5th valve.


Needs more cleanup, but that will get done later.


This is the crazy way these will have to be oriented in order to fit the space and still be reachable by my levers.

[MiBrassFS]

Those really are great pictures of Wade.

For there to be a great picture of me, it would need to be AI.

I don’t know about that. I imagine you have a cheering section, too, especially when you’re laying it down with all that big, shiny hardware.

Or, you could be right!

[the elephant]

Today, I marked, drilled, tapped, and (sort of) cleaned up enough to ensure that the valves still worked correctly. Now I can more carefully sand and buff these back to looking *okay*. (They are too scarred up to look *nice* but that does not really matter to me right now.)

My micro drill press is very accurate and much easier to use than my six-foot-tall floor drill press. I like it a lot. I got it from some stoner guy on the societal cesspool known as "Facebook Marketplace", and it has been one of my best finds there to date.


I have a doctor's appointment and then a late lunch in town with the wife. I will try to buff these tonight, but I also need to put in a few hours on the Broughton and Prokofiev, so maybe not…

The 5th valve, drilled and tapped…


The 6th valve—reassembled—with the cork plate orientated correctly for my application. Whew…

[prairieboy1]

As usual, a terrific post! How great to see those beautiful and enthused kids in the photograph!

[bloke]

Those pre-buffed casings remind me of when I grind the obverse sides of old Deutsche marks down smooth (to minimize additional weight) prior to soldering them onto the rounded ends of rotor paddles.

[the elephant]

My used Yamaha leadpipe union from a parted-out YBB-641 arrived this morning, and I had to remove the gobs of internal solder the seller failed to remove when he pulled it, sand off the lacquer (out of stripper at the moment) and melt out the adhesive that was applied at the factory to keep the parts together.

Despite some small marks from the pliers used to break the heated components apart, it cleaned up nicely and should look great (like the currently scored-up valves) once assembled and buffed out.

Once everything was cleaned up, I used a very sharp scraper to open up one end just enough to slip it over the valve knuckle. I still have to do that to the other end, but that ought not take too long.

This means I will not have to lop off half an inch from my MTS, so I am quite pleased.

[bloke]

What's the inside span across those St. Pete rotor knuckles (if you still need that slide bow) ?