Hawaii Symphony Orchestra

[russiantuba]

https://www.myhso.org/auditions

No excerpts posted yet, and all applicants must audition live in Hawaii. This will likely be an expensive audition to take assuming the excerpts suggest use of a bass tuba and contrabass

21 weeks of guaranteed pay with all over scale at $1433 a week, so roughly $30,000 a year.

[the elephant]

Did TJ quit?

[russiantuba]

Did TJ quit?

I asked him and have not received a response. However, his website states he is the “acting principal tubist”, and the website description of the orchestra says they have 60 core musicians and 20 per service. T. J. is fulltime with the Royal Hawaiian Band, which pays quite a bit more. I suspect this position is an official posting for a core position, but I could totally be wrong.

[UncleBeer]

Wonder if it's one o' those gigs where they make you audition...for your own job.

[Mark]

21 weeks of guaranteed pay with all over scale at $1433 a week, so roughly $30,000 a year.

So, not quite enough to cover 21 weeks of rent in Hawaii?

[MiBrassFS]

I would imagine that the orchestra legally has to post core positions to officially and permanently fill them.

[russiantuba]

I would imagine that the orchestra legally has to post core positions to officially and permanently fill them.

Not always. Depends on the CBA. Sarasota didn’t audition after Jay Hunsberger left but was part of their CBA at the time.

[MiBrassFS]

I would imagine that the orchestra legally has to post core positions to officially and permanently fill them.

Not always. Depends on the CBA. Sarasota didn’t audition after Jay Hunsberger left but was part of their CBA at the time.

Nothing ever is 100% everything. They are an AFM orchestra, so chances are pretty good.

https://members.afm.org/locals/info/number/677

https://musicianshawaii.com/

If it was part of the CBA in Sarasota and the orchestra did not hold an audition, grievances could have been filed and the AFM can be involved in the enforcement of the CBA. There may just not have been any interested parties that wanted to stir that pot.

[russiantuba]

Nothing ever is 100% everything. They are an AFM orchestra, so chances are pretty good.

https://members.afm.org/locals/info/number/677

https://musicianshawaii.com/

If it was part of the CBA in Sarasota and the orchestra did not hold an audition, grievances could have been filed and the AFM can be involved in the enforcement of the CBA. There may just not have been any interested parties that wanted to stir that pot.

They did hold an audition in 2023—I took it. Before that, Aaron Tindall held the position, but there was never an audition. He was there for a year or two before that.

Sidenote—there could have been a local audition announced that was never publicized. Fort Wayne did such this last year before the national audition, but decided to have applicants and a date for the national audition before the local audition took place (guessing they didn’t expect to have a winner at it, though the two people at the local audition have been filling in the past several years).

[tindalltuba]

Just to clear the air here:
I was playing in Italy at La Scala for many months in the spring/summer of 2017. My phone rang and it was management of the Sarasota Orchestra. They were calling out of the blue to offer me a one year position as Jay Hunsberger had just retired. I accepted, and we moved from Miami to Sarasota.

Within their CBA the SO could vote to move a one year principal position holder over to tenure track at the end of that first season with a % of the core members voting to do so. That vote was held at the end of that first season with the MD, and I was converted to tenure track. I held that position for 6 years until I won my present position (via 4 rounds of a blind national audition) with the Naples Philharmonic in 2022. We now live in Naples where I play the 40 week season there, as well as teach my wonderful students in Miami and LA.

Never forget that these entities are a business, and will do what they wish - how they wish to sometimes. Being ready at a moments notice, and doing a good job goes a long ways in today’s musical society.

Best of luck to all auditioning for this position in Hawaii!

[MiBrassFS]

Always nice to hear directly from the source. They are, indeed, businesses.

[russiantuba]

Just to clear the air here:
I was playing in Italy at La Scala for many months in the spring/summer of 2017. My phone rang and it was management of the Sarasota Orchestra. They were calling out of the blue to offer me a one year position as Jay Hunsberger had just retired. I accepted, and we moved from Miami to Sarasota.

Within their CBA the SO could vote to move a one year principal position holder over to tenure track at the end of that first season with a % of the core members voting to do so. That vote was held at the end of that first season with the MD, and I was converted to tenure track. I held that position for 6 years until I won my present position (via 4 rounds of a blind national audition) with the Naples Philharmonic in 2022. We now live in Naples where I play the 40 week season there, as well as teach my wonderful students in Miami and LA.

Never forget that these entities are a business, and will do what they wish - how they wish to sometimes. Being ready at a moments notice, and doing a good job goes a long ways in today’s musical society.

Best of luck to all auditioning for this position in Hawaii!

@tindalltuba thank you for clarifying this--and I did not intend to accuse or send negative reprise. I had always heard second hand that you were called in for a one year and was voted to stay in the position as per the CBA, as no audition was ever publicly posted. Glad I heard correctly!

You are such a strong player with insurmountable success. When prepping for the recent audition, I kept saying that I had to set the bar high to be on the level you were, something I won't ever achieve, but to quote you, "never lick from the lollipop of mediocrity"

[russiantuba]

If social media “story” I saw was correct, congrats to Andy Abel for winning the Hawaii Symphony position

[bloke]

re: previous comment

It's not just symphony orchestras, but combo gigs not only don't pay ANY more than they paid prior to the orchestrated "covid" hyperinflation thing, but they don't pay AS MUCH (in actual numbers of dollars - inflation aside) as they paid decades ago.

A "major" orchestra (with which I'm familiar) has had two dollar amount pay CUTS in the last few years (both prior to the hyperinflation of the last three years).

Live music is a dying industry, though - when people interact with it (whether people on stage are reading notes, performing their own notes, or making up note passages on the fly) - it makes them smile.

My granddaughter (one of those rare ones who could do just about anything and excel...and actually hyper-excelling at a bunch of things - academics/Scouts/et al) has "the bug"...and her parents (musicians) are asking ME to talk her off the ledge...while - at the same time - they are encouraging her.

me - jazz combo gigs - I was paid (in dollars, last night) only about 160% of what I was paid to play similar jobs in the early 1980's.
yeah...but it's a helluva lot more fun (and liberating) to play those types of jobs than to sit in the back in a monkey suit, count measures, and occasionally enter - playing (the brass versions of) percussion parts.

[Schlitzz]

I would say that his brother, is better looking.

[Colby Fahrenbacher]

If reports are true, congrats to Andy on his accomplishment and best of luck to him and the Hawaii Symphony. Hopefully they won't let deranged and uninformed commentary distract them from making great music in a wonderful industry.

[russiantuba]

Last Row Music, which go on official reports and notifications, support that Andy won. Congrats to him!

[russiantuba]

re: previous comment


me - jazz combo gigs - I was paid (in dollars, last night) only about 160% of what I was paid to play similar jobs in the early 1980's.
yeah...but it's a helluva lot more fun (and liberating) to play those types of jobs than to sit in the back in a monkey suit, count measures, and occasionally enter - playing (the brass versions of) percussion parts.

With the pay of this job, unfortunately, the winner is going to have to do a hefty amount of other work outside of the symphony to make ends meet. There are several types of this style of playing there.

The person who held season contracts for the past decade plays in the highest paying ensemble job on the islands plus teaches at the state flagship school.

Something I teach my “kollij” kiddos is how to walk a bass line and improv. I don’t focus on it, and one of my current performance majors also plays and gigs on jazz bass. I am not worried about him finding work.

[bloke]

yeah...They'll need an actual job to supplement this part-time job...and something that pays real money...not just something like orchestra librarian, or something of that nature.

[russiantuba]

yeah...They'll need an actual job to supplement this part-time job...and something that pays real money...not just something like orchestra librarian, or something of that nature.

When this job was “open” last time, for the seasonal contracts, I talked to a tubist who considered it, said he would try to live with 4-5 other musicians in a shoebox apartment. I was in my DMA at the time, and my stipend was substantial for someone who grew up poor, but I did the basic math that adjusted for inflation at the time for what the orchestra paid, that I was making about the same, and not enough to pay rent alone in Hawaii. One of the musicians I trust most, and is one of the most musical people who has overcame focal dystonia, who had a position in the old group before it folded, sent me some recordings and it was apparent they were an amazing orchestra. This person, a good friend of Gene Pokorny who beat him at a few auditions, would take several gigs on the mainland, such as subbing for Gene with Utah Symphony.

However, taking music librarian type jobs might help prevent burnout, or could make you hate more at the same time.