alphorn

[jerseyeuph]

I play several natural instruments and have become interested in obtaining an alphorn. I see that Thomann sells a range of instruments, including their store brand as well as horns by Neumann, who has an informative web site.

Please tell us about your alphorn experience:
-horn(s) you own
-mouthpiece selection
-in F or F# or other? (which is best for ensemble playing in the U.S., assuming that’s a thing?)
-anything else interesting or informative

Thanks!

[tylerferris1213]

I don't own one, but most people I know have an alphorn in F.

[Mary Ann]

Get one in F because that is what others are most likely to have. We hornists play it with a horn mouthpiece. The portable fiberglass ones sound just fine, too.

[Snake Charmer]

We hornists play it with a horn mouthpiece.

Most interesting is that the alphorn always sounds like an alphorn, no matter what mouthpiece you use. Some years ago we had a discussion about this and I was able to try it with my tuba and euph sized mp with no discernible sound difference.
I would go for F as well, they are more common outside the alps and easier to play with other groups.

[spirtuba]

Here in Switzerland Alphorns are in Gb mostly... I guess they want to stay among themselves. So, if you are not an anti-social mountain dweller I think you are better off with one in F.

I know a few people who play, I could find out who makes good alphorns here, although probably a bit expensive, Switzerland, you know...

[Doc]

Three of the guys I play with play alphorns. They all have F and F#/Gb "shanks" (I don't know the proper name for that piece). One guy picked his up directly from the maker at his workshop in Austria, and it wasn't cheap. One was acquired somewhere in Germany many years ago, and the third was brought over a couple years ago by a German brass band (friends of ours) on tour and sold it to another musician friend. I picked it up from them in north Texas while playing an Oktoberfest and delivered it down south to the owner. I made sure to inspect it before I took possession - it had the F and F# shank/attachment/insert thing. They all have gig bags, btw, two of which are very nice. These guys use wooden alphorn mouthpieces, although I'm not sure on the size. I had a go on one of them, and the mouthpiece was smaller than I anticipated. Regarding F or F#, I know of no "standard tuning." A couple of the guys play call/answer/echo stuff at long distances at festivals and larger venues - they just make sure they use the same key.

[jerseyeuph]

Thanks everyone.

It turns out there is an alphorn workshop that’s part of a community music program located 11 mi from home(!), so I’ve also sent my questions to the coordinator.

I’d still love to hear from other players in the Forum.

[Dan Schultz]

I purchased the Alphorn I play off Ebay about twenty years ago. It was hand made by Otto Emmenegger probably in the 60's. It originally came in the key of Gb and had an extension that plugged in between the upper and lower sections to drop the pitch to F. F seems to be the most common in the US but I'm glad I had the option to play in either key. The recent Alphorns that my local German Club purchased about ten years ago were made in the US and came with two upper sections... one for Gb and one for F.

I know folks who can play about any range on just one mouthpiece. However... I am a tuba player sometimes doubling on euphonium and have found that since I usually play the 3rd or 4th Alphorn part (lower range)... a larger diameter cup around the size of a large euph mp works best for me.

Another nice thing about the convertible keys is that I also built a valve section from an F horn cluster that takes the Gb components to F and makes the horn fully chromatic. If I desire to do so... I can play my Alphorn like an F tuba. In fact... I actually used the chromatic version at a Merry Tuba Christmas a few years back.

BTW.... Thomann not only sells a wide variety of Alphorns but also has a line of adapters to enable one to use whatever MP a player is accustomed to.

[jerseyeuph]

Very helpful, Dan. Thanks!

[bloke]

I tend to suspect that the F-sharp ones are traditional “high pitch” (likely formerly considered to be) F natural, which is right at the same thing as modern F-sharp...

...The same goes for bagpipes, whereas they call it an A natural, it sounds like an A-sharp/B-flat, because it’s the old high-pitch thing.

I used the word “suspect“. I’m no expert here, and I’m perfectly willing to be corrected/educated.

[jerseyeuph]

That’s interesting, Bloke. Thanks.

I’ll go with modern F if I buy a new horn, which is likely.

If something used comes along, I may not worry about it.

[BopEuph]

What I've learned with the alphorn:

1.) Everyone locally (which is like four guys) plays in F.

2.) Finding actual literature is extremely difficult. I assume it's either because it's learned by rote or because I don't understand German. The only two alphorn calls I know, I can't tell you what they're called, as the band refers to them as "alphorn 1" and "alphorn 2." I think "1" is either "Kaiser Wilhelm" or "The King's Favorite Alphorn Call," which is a popular polka band feature.

3.) It's best to get your mouthpiece from the same maker as the horn, as the shank taper can vary between different makers.

4.) Wooden mouthpieces come in trumpet to trombone size.

5.) You can get an adapter for a trombone mouthpiece. I might get an adapter for mine, but to respectfully disagree with what I've read here, using a brass mouthpiece can sound slightly more brassy to me. This particular mouthpiece has some strange behaviors, though; and popping in my trombone mouthpiece, even with massive leaking, shows that some of my issues are equipment related and not me.

6.) The absolute best thing I did for my alphorn chops was to read through the first series of every exercise in the Bai Lin book every day. Middle C=low F for euphonium, so I think of it as reading bass clef transposing up one step. Obviously, you can only play one series since there's no valves, so you can blow through the book in about 20 minutes.

7.) Get the Thomann case if it doesn't come with it. I searched for years for a stateside case and could never find one. The price is okay (not a great deal), but I couldn't find another case at that price point. Dust clings to this horn like crazy, so I always keep it in the case now.

[jerseyeuph]

Thanks Bop!

What model alphorn are you playing?

I stumbled onto these recently:
http://mccoyshornlibrary.com/index.php? ... path=60_69

[BopEuph]

So there's a seller (Swiss1712) on eBay that occasionally sells B stock horns. I can't remember what company it comes from, but it does ship from Switzerland. It's not a great horn (intonation is squirrely), but good enough for someone who occasionally has their curiosity piqued by it.

If your sniping technique is good enough, you can get one for about $500. I won mine for $750, and seen them go up to around $1500.

The auctions used to happen about once a month, but now it's more unpredictable.

When I'm not deep in my practice routine I'll find his website again. It would be easier to find it here in my history than my email history for this instrument like 5 years ago.

[TubaRay]

For those interested in listening to alphorn music, here's a link that features Lisa Stoll, an accomplished player. A bonus on this clip is hearing the Swiss group, Oesch's die Dritten, a family group, with some serious yodeling. Personally, I could watch the video with the sound off, and still enjoy it. The alphorn music begins around 1:40.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MvFFb_oUvzY

[jerseyeuph]

She also has a few albums available on Apple Music.

[Mary Ann]

For those interested in listening to alphorn music, here's a link that features Lisa Stoll, an accomplished player. A bonus on this clip is hearing the Swiss group, Oesch's die Dritten, a family group, with some serious yodeling. Personally, I could watch the video with the sound off, and still enjoy it. The alphorn music begins around 1:40.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MvFFb_oUvzY

That's cool....looks like she has a crook for it too, to change the key.

[BopEuph]

Thanks Bop!

What model alphorn are you playing?

I stumbled onto these recently:
http://mccoyshornlibrary.com/index.php? ... path=60_69

Found the site:

http://www.heimatklang.com/

I got a natural spruce one, and lists on the site for about EU 1400. So I got a deal...but again, I think the ones they list on eBay are their B stock.

As for that literature link, I came across that, but I'm wanting to learn more of the alphorn calls and less of the classical literature...though I recently read some article that said that the alphorn might not be as old as we think, and that the pride of the alphorn in Switzerland might have actually been synthetically created in the 19th-20th century to give them their own unique nationalist image for tourism. So the literature you linked might be the "real" literature. But I digress.

Also, another weird fact I found in that same place: Willson used to make a valve section for alphorns made to order, until the owner of the company got numerous death threats.

[jerseyeuph]

Yikes!

I was thinking about how I might acquire/build a valve section. I assume that a horn in F# with a crook to play in F would be a better bet and the valve set could then take the place of the crook.

I see that one of the Thomann brand horns in F has the option of a separate ‘leadpipe’ section to bring the horn up to F#.

Thanks for the link.

[BopEuph]

I was thinking about how I might acquire/build a valve section. I assume that a horn in F# with a crook to play in F would be a better bet and the valve set could then take the place of the crook.

@Dan Schultz is your guy. I've thought about acquiring a trumpet valve cluster and trying that, but the receiver in the horn is about the size of a euro shank receiver for a euphonium, which is even smaller than a trumpet bore. So there will be a Bernoulli effect going on if I were to go that route.

Either way, the way I see it, is there's little need for an alphorn player in Florida, and an even smaller need for a valve playing alphorn.