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It's about time for many of us tuba-buyers/sellers to think more along the lines of "meet somewhere in the geographic middle"
bloke "#roadtrip"
I was pondering the idea with another well known repairman and tubist in the community of starting something like Uber, but called "TUber" or something with a network of nationwide & regional "drivers" who are on call to hand transport horns. Handoff's midway to destination if it's farther than a day's drive either way, split on logistics profit etc. I think it would be a great venture.
I know a guy who does this with scooters (Vespa, Lambretta) for a living. He uses a pickup and trailer and does some wheeling and dealing along the way. It would be heck of a lot easier with Tubas and a MiniVan. https://www.facebook.com/scooterhauler/ ... e_internal
Humm, no skills but retired with a class B license. There may be a business opportunity... : )
Once money starts changing hands several issues arise: your vehicle insurance will increase and your carrier may even cancel it. If you don't change your insurance and have an accident - your carrier will not cover you if they find out what you were engaged in transport for hire. Gets messier if you are crossing state lines as now it's interstate commerce. It varies, but states have rules and regulations regarding this kind of activity and permits and fees. If something happens to the horn via an accident or say you stop to relieve yourself and it's stolen out of your vehicle -don't think for a minute that the owner isn't coming after you to compensate them for their tuba. With 5 & 10 grand tubas pretty common do you want to be on the hook for that or even have to engage legal counsel at $400 an hour (and up for the best) to represent you? These days kids sue parents and vice versa and siblings sue each other. Life long friends will sue each other when money is involved. Tuba players won't bat an eyelash coming after you for their lost tuba. Even if each party signs off on liability don't think that will cover you when the XXXX hits the fan. Good lawyers find ways.
Even if there is no money changing hands and it's all we're just good buddy's in the tuba community - unless you really know somebody - always assume there are sharks in the water. I can just see a horn is going cross country and some 20 year old kid signs up to cover the middle part - perhaps with good intent - gets horn at the hand off - drives a few miles - thinks "Hey I've never tried a Thor before - pulls over takes horn out toots a few notes - thinks I deserve a great horn now just because" and now he just drives on home with his shiny new to him free Thor - and isn't a free Thor the best Thor? And it turns out he used a fake name and address and a burner phone and nobody has his photo or knows him. And even if someone does he claims he was robbed or never got the horn or claims he indeed handed it off to the the next guy in the transport chain AND that must be the guy who stole it. What a can of worms that becomes.
Yes we do it in animal transport. I'm a rescue foster and we move about 35-50 dogs from 2 rural shelters in TN close to KY up north every couple weeks. But no money changes hands and it's all volunteers and all folks who are well known in the rescue community in person and all transports have a minimum of 2 people along for the ride up here and back down there - a distance of about 900 miles each way. And shelter dogs (while priceless) are not going to be valued in the thousands of dollars in the event of a loss. And nobody is personally liable as it's non-profits involved with their own insurance coverage.
tofu wrote: ↑Tue Mar 02, 2021 12:03 am
Once money starts changing hands several issues arise: your vehicle insurance will increase and your carrier may even cancel it. If you don't change your insurance and have an accident - your carrier will not cover you if they find out what you were engaged in transport for hire. Gets messier if you are crossing state lines as now it's interstate commerce. It varies, but states have rules and regulations regarding this kind of activity and permits and fees. If something happens to the horn via an accident or say you stop to relieve yourself and it's stolen out of your vehicle -don't think for a minute that the owner isn't coming after you to compensate them for their tuba. With 5 & 10 grand tubas pretty common do you want to be on the hook for that or even have to engage legal counsel at $400 an hour (and up for the best) to represent you? These days kids sue parents and vice versa and siblings sue each other. Life long friends will sue each other when money is involved. Tuba players won't bat an eyelash coming after you for their lost tuba. Even if each party signs off on liability don't think that will cover you when the XXXX hits the fan. Good lawyers find ways.
Even if there is no money changing hands and it's all we're just good buddy's in the tuba community - unless you really know somebody - always assume there are sharks in the water. I can just see a horn is going cross country and some 20 year old kid signs up to cover the middle part - perhaps with good intent - gets horn at the hand off - drives a few miles - thinks "Hey I've never tried a Thor before - pulls over takes horn out toots a few notes - thinks I deserve a great horn now just because" and now he just drives on home with his shiny new to him free Thor - and isn't a free Thor the best Thor? And it turns out he used a fake name and address and a burner phone and nobody has his photo or knows him. And even if someone does he claims he was robbed or never got the horn or claims he indeed handed it off to the the next guy in the transport chain AND that must be the guy who stole it. What a can of worms that becomes.
Yes we do it in animal transport. I'm a rescue foster and we move about 35-50 dogs from 2 rural shelters in TN close to KY up north every couple weeks. But no money changes hands and it's all volunteers and all folks who are well known in the rescue community in person and all transports have a minimum of 2 people along for the ride up here and back down there - a distance of about 900 miles each way. And shelter dogs (while priceless) are not going to be valued in the thousands of dollars in the event of a loss. And nobody is personally liable as it's non-profits involved with their own insurance coverage.
With all those woulda, coulda shoulda ideas..businesses like Uber and Lyft, or Roadie or any entrepreneur style start ups would never have opened and become what they are had they listened to all the negative advice and cons of opening a new business. Instead they chose to forge a new path, take the hits and conquer it.
Thought Criminal
Mack Brass Artiste
TU422L with TU25
1964 Conn 36k with CB Arnold Jacobs
Accent (By B&S) 952R with Bach12
The Fourth Estate is the Fifth Column
Furguson11 wrote: ↑Mon Mar 01, 2021 8:53 pm
I was pondering the idea with another well known repairman and tubist in the community of starting something like Uber, but called "TUber" or something with a network of nationwide & regional "drivers" who are on call to hand transport horns. Handoff's midway to destination if it's farther than a day's drive either way, split on logistics profit etc. I think it would be a great venture.
what a great idea! who's down for a road trip to pick up a coupla horns for me?
tofu wrote: ↑Tue Mar 02, 2021 12:03 am
Once money starts changing hands several issues arise: your vehicle insurance will increase and your carrier may even cancel it. If you don't change your insurance and have an accident - your carrier will not cover you if they find out what you were engaged in transport for hire. Gets messier if you are crossing state lines as now it's interstate commerce. It varies, but states have rules and regulations regarding this kind of activity and permits and fees. If something happens to the horn via an accident or say you stop to relieve yourself and it's stolen out of your vehicle -don't think for a minute that the owner isn't coming after you to compensate them for their tuba. With 5 & 10 grand tubas pretty common do you want to be on the hook for that or even have to engage legal counsel at $400 an hour (and up for the best) to represent you? These days kids sue parents and vice versa and siblings sue each other. Life long friends will sue each other when money is involved. Tuba players won't bat an eyelash coming after you for their lost tuba. Even if each party signs off on liability don't think that will cover you when the XXXX hits the fan. Good lawyers find ways.
Even if there is no money changing hands and it's all we're just good buddy's in the tuba community - unless you really know somebody - always assume there are sharks in the water. I can just see a horn is going cross country and some 20 year old kid signs up to cover the middle part - perhaps with good intent - gets horn at the hand off - drives a few miles - thinks "Hey I've never tried a Thor before - pulls over takes horn out toots a few notes - thinks I deserve a great horn now just because" and now he just drives on home with his shiny new to him free Thor - and isn't a free Thor the best Thor? And it turns out he used a fake name and address and a burner phone and nobody has his photo or knows him. And even if someone does he claims he was robbed or never got the horn or claims he indeed handed it off to the the next guy in the transport chain AND that must be the guy who stole it. What a can of worms that becomes.
Yes we do it in animal transport. I'm a rescue foster and we move about 35-50 dogs from 2 rural shelters in TN close to KY up north every couple weeks. But no money changes hands and it's all volunteers and all folks who are well known in the rescue community in person and all transports have a minimum of 2 people along for the ride up here and back down there - a distance of about 900 miles each way. And shelter dogs (while priceless) are not going to be valued in the thousands of dollars in the event of a loss. And nobody is personally liable as it's non-profits involved with their own insurance coverage.
With all those woulda, coulda shoulda ideas..businesses like Uber and Lyft, or Roadie or any entrepreneur style start ups would never have opened and become what they are had they listened to all the negative advice and cons of opening a new business. Instead they chose to forge a new path, take the hits and conquer it.
I'm a venture capitalist and I understand risk & reward. You obviously don't. These are all for profit companies that understood the risk they were taking on. People thinking I'll do a good deed and pick up a bit of spare change never imagine the amount of risk they are taking on. My comments aren't about not doing something but understanding what one is getting into and how that can come back to bite you if you don't protect yourself. It's not about not taking risks. Most business start ups fail & that can be traced to people not understanding the risks and how to mitigate them or if those risks justified the reward. All those companies that you list knew that when they started their businesses and also understood the reward to risk ratio and how much reward was needed for the potential level of risk and understood the downside of failure. Somebody hauling a tuba for gas money and a good feeling may not be enough return to compensate for having to cough up 10 grand plus legal fees for somebody's lost tuba nor begin to imagine the scenario where that might happen.
To be honest your comments on this forum seem to be almost universally negative. You are the TubaForum.net Spiro Agnew Nattering Nabob of Negativism.
I'm a venture capitalist and I understand risk & reward. You obviously don't. These are all for profit companies that understood the risk they were taking on. People thinking I'll do a good deed and pick up a bit of spare change never imagine the amount of risk they are taking on. My comments aren't about not doing something but understanding what one is getting into and how that can come back to bite you if you don't protect yourself. It's not about not taking risks. Most business start ups fail & that can be traced to people not understanding the risks and how to mitigate them or if those risks justified the reward. All those companies that you list knew that when they started their businesses and also understood the reward to risk ratio and how much reward was needed for the potential level of risk and understood the downside of failure. Somebody hauling a tuba for gas money and a good feeling may not be enough return to compensate for having to cough up 10 grand plus legal fees for somebody's lost tuba nor begin to imagine the scenario where that might happen.
To be honest your comments on this forum seem to be almost universally negative. You are the TubaForum.net Spiro Agnew Nattering Nabob of Negativism.
What are you rattling on about? I did mention it should be an APP based service and probably NOT a "for gas money and good feeling" job. I understand the risks VERY well and think the whole buddy buddy system that some others have suggested IS a bad idea due to the legal risks (unless it's a private transport between 2 friends off the books that no one knows about and not "official" for the "service" should one become available. But thanks for letting me know you aren't interested in joining the list of people who are willing to drive should this become a thing in the future. There are Doers and there are those who will sit at the starting line in Fear in life, which one you are is solely up to you. I'm pretty sure personal attacks and end fighting are something we were trying to avoid on this site, let me know if I'm wrong about that.
Last edited by KingTuba1241X on Wed Mar 03, 2021 10:27 am, edited 1 time in total.
tofu wrote: ↑Tue Mar 02, 2021 12:03 am
Once money starts changing hands several issues arise: your vehicle insurance will increase and your carrier may even cancel it. If you don't change your insurance and have an accident - your carrier will not cover you if they find out what you were engaged in transport for hire. Gets messier if you are crossing state lines as now it's interstate commerce. It varies, but states have rules and regulations regarding this kind of activity and permits and fees. If something happens to the horn via an accident or say you stop to relieve yourself and it's stolen out of your vehicle -don't think for a minute that the owner isn't coming after you to compensate them for their tuba. With 5 & 10 grand tubas pretty common do you want to be on the hook for that or even have to engage legal counsel at $400 an hour (and up for the best) to represent you? These days kids sue parents and vice versa and siblings sue each other. Life long friends will sue each other when money is involved. Tuba players won't bat an eyelash coming after you for their lost tuba. Even if each party signs off on liability don't think that will cover you when the XXXX hits the fan. Good lawyers find ways.
Even if there is no money changing hands and it's all we're just good buddy's in the tuba community - unless you really know somebody - always assume there are sharks in the water. I can just see a horn is going cross country and some 20 year old kid signs up to cover the middle part - perhaps with good intent - gets horn at the hand off - drives a few miles - thinks "Hey I've never tried a Thor before - pulls over takes horn out toots a few notes - thinks I deserve a great horn now just because" and now he just drives on home with his shiny new to him free Thor - and isn't a free Thor the best Thor? And it turns out he used a fake name and address and a burner phone and nobody has his photo or knows him. And even if someone does he claims he was robbed or never got the horn or claims he indeed handed it off to the the next guy in the transport chain AND that must be the guy who stole it. What a can of worms that becomes.
Yes we do it in animal transport. I'm a rescue foster and we move about 35-50 dogs from 2 rural shelters in TN close to KY up north every couple weeks. But no money changes hands and it's all volunteers and all folks who are well known in the rescue community in person and all transports have a minimum of 2 people along for the ride up here and back down there - a distance of about 900 miles each way. And shelter dogs (while priceless) are not going to be valued in the thousands of dollars in the event of a loss. And nobody is personally liable as it's non-profits involved with their own insurance coverage.
With all those woulda, coulda shoulda ideas..businesses like Uber and Lyft, or Roadie or any entrepreneur style start ups would never have opened and become what they are had they listened to all the negative advice and cons of opening a new business. Instead they chose to forge a new path, take the hits and conquer it.
I'm a venture capitalist and I understand risk & reward. You obviously don't. These are all for profit companies that understood the risk they were taking on. People thinking I'll do a good deed and pick up a bit of spare change never imagine the amount of risk they are taking on. My comments aren't about not doing something but understanding what one is getting into and how that can come back to bite you if you don't protect yourself. It's not about not taking risks. Most business start ups fail & that can be traced to people not understanding the risks and how to mitigate them or if those risks justified the reward. All those companies that you list knew that when they started their businesses and also understood the reward to risk ratio and how much reward was needed for the potential level of risk and understood the downside of failure. Somebody hauling a tuba for gas money and a good feeling may not be enough return to compensate for having to cough up 10 grand plus legal fees for somebody's lost tuba nor begin to imagine the scenario where that might happen.
To be honest your comments on this forum seem to be almost universally negative. You are the TubaForum.net Spiro Agnew Nattering Nabob of Negativism.
Hey I resemble that remark, and I resent watching this thread, popcorn is not on my fatty liver diet!
this idea was bounced around tubenet a couple of times. In the end, I don't think there is a big enough market to make it anything more than knowing a buddy that is traveling from one place to another and asking him or her to put a tuba in the back of his car.
For the record, I've done this twice, and I've also allowed my house to be a "safe house" where someone dropped off a horn and I've held onto it until the buyer could make it to my place to pick it up.
And guys, play nice. We're supposed to be better than this
