New tubas...

[Grumpikins]

At the tuba christmas event I noticed that several newer tubas of different brands had a very noticeable "angle" where the actual bell was attached to the bell stack in manufacturing. Normally I would think that this was an anomaly, but it was easily visible on multiple horns. I know one was an Eastman 4/4 cc tuba 1 year old and another was a B&S f tuba. There were several other horns I saw it on, but didn't catch their brands.

I dont know the origin of these horns, wonder if it's the same Chinese factory. To me this seems like poor craftsmanship. It's two pieces grafted together in a manner that should look seamless.

Anybody else notice this?

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[Sousaswag]

Interested in what you mean.

What angle are you describing? I’m thinking of old 345’s with F’d up ferrules that look weird.

[LeMark]

Yeah, I have to admit being a little confused myself

[arpthark]

Yeah, I have never noticed this. If it was a real B&S F it definitely wasn't made in China, though.

[donn]

"Actual bell" probably is the bell flare, but if instead it refers to the entire piece we usually think of as the bell ... I think it isn't uncommon for the lower part of the bell to have a conical shape that generously approximates the classic horn profile, such that the transition is sort of noticeable where the bell attaches to the bottom bow. Smaller Yamahas for example.

[UncleBeer]

A picture showing what you describe would help enormously.

[Grumpikins]

My fat fingers on this tiny phone. The red lines profile, the green is the general area where I saw the angle.

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[Grumpikins]

Uggh.

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[Grumpikins]

I first saw this on the eastman tuba. Then as we were playing it was on my mind and I started seeing it on other horns around the room. But not on older horns. Does anyone else notice this? Look for it and tell me I'm not crazy. ....ok, I am crazy, but...

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[arpthark]

I have a newer Eastman 4/4 CC. Bought new in 2022. Let me find a pic:



Do you see it here?

[Mary Ann]

Let's just tell him he's crazy!!

[BRS]

.

[Grumpikins]

Not in that picture. Beautiful horn. He said his was the 4/4, but it seemed to have a larger diameter bell throat. On this fellows horn it was quite visible. Maybe it was just a minor goof in production... doesn't explain seeing it on other horns as well.

The B&S horn was an f, recently acquired by my friends son. He's studying with Timothy Northcut now. I might get a chance to get a better look in the spring.

Side note. I'm not trying to knock on anybodys instrument. If it works for them, then it's right.

I'm the guy that drives crappy old cars because I cant stand all the new tech bells and whistles on newer cars...

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[Grumpikins]

Reflected light can be deceiving.

I think you may be reading where the flare is brazed to the stack. Sometimes there is a line all the way around the bell. The bell and stack should be tangent to each other, but that braze line might create an optical illusion to the contrary.

That's exactly the spot I'm talking about. But looking at the outline profile, it was a visible angle like I sketched.

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[Mary Ann]

driving crappy old cars -- I'm close to a crossroads with the Subaru. It is starting to show it might be on its way down, although it doesn't have the miles that many do. But some get those miles in far fewer years than mine. I absolutely do not want a car that tells me how to drive, or even worse. tries to drive for me if the installed software detects something it has been programmed to react to. I like tubas better, even ones I can't play very well.
Two friends have just bought vehicles that turn themselves off when they have stopped for a pretty short period of time, and then restart themselves when they hit the gas pedal again. NO NO NO NO NO!! I'm told it has to do with pollution, of not having cars idling for long periods ("long" apparently being defined as "more than one second") in traffic.

[Grumpikins]

Amen....

All I need is 4w drive, heat, and a/c.

Yup. I'm crazy!


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[humBell]

Cars what stop them selves at a light, my impression was that they were doing something kinda clever: the engine is stopped just before spark so that all that is needed to restart it it is that spark. It is disconcerting, but i suppose i can live with it.

But yeah, i am generally disconcert by odd behaviors from vehicles, and somehow felt oddly well prepared for the weird lane correction programs in modern cars what automatically turn ya back into the lane by having driven a loose 80s steering column on a rear engine vehicle, where cross winds push the front of the car back and forth, and said forces coming back up to the steering wheel. Being passed by a semi in such a vehicle is a test unto itself.

And while a discontinuous bell curve offends my sense of geometry, having recently seen someone demonstrate underlying bugle principles with hose sections, funnels as bells, and mouthpieces, and thinking "ya know, that don't sound half bad!" I think i could get over the aesthetic factors if the sonar quality were to my liking. Indeed, i' be totally psyched to make something passing as music emerge from a heap of trash... Especially if i put the trash heap together.
Like the tale of Musashi winning duel with a sword he carved from an oar on his way there.

But i too have my own flaws which do not hold up under criticism, so i'l retire to my glass house...

Thanks for putting up with my ill- considered opinions.

[dp]

The OP is asking about tuba assembly where the bell exits the ferrule slightly crooked and points off to the side,
instead of being laid out so that the bell taper naturally clears the body of the horn.

If the bell and body of the horn are centered in/near the same plane, and the centerline of the bell doesn't allow the flare to clear the body of the horn, or the bottom bow points toward the body of the horn, then the bell has to be angled out sidewise to clear. Usually the centerline of the body has to line up slightly behind the centerline of the bell for the bell to point "straight up", with the bottom bow aimed so the bell can exit the ferrule square and clear the body (e.g. not tilted IN the ferrule to clear.)

[Mary Ann]

Clearly -- but his observations seemed to be on individual tubas of models that are not all that way. I'd love it if he could get a picture. Can't say I'd like to receive a brand new tuba whose bell was a bit off center. I have enough trouble with the ones that appear perfect.

[donn]

Bell exits the ferrule slightly crooked and points off to the side? Like this? It's what I was talking about, but not the OP I believe.