New to me tuba!

[Sousaswag]

ProTec, Wessex. Thanks.

I’d love to find a used Altieri… Those things fit ANYTHING. Anyone? Anyone?

[Sousaswag]

Tiny finger buttons…

I forgot to ask. I’ve seen some put Yamaha buttons on these tubas. Are they a direct fit or does the stem need to be modified?

[bloke]

Tiny finger buttons…

I forgot to ask. I’ve seen some put Yamaha buttons on these tubas. Are they a direct fit or does the stem need to be modified?

The Yamaha brass seems to be a relatively soft yellow brass alloy, the stems (if oem) are probably 8-32 SAE, and I've always been able (going back-and-forth carefully - taking my time) to get the M4 x .75 Yamaha buttons to be "convinced" into the 8-32 SAE stem threads.

The "professional" Yamaha buttons sport (genuine) mop pearls.

...and (again) please don't strip that bell lacquer. That bell can be smoothed out (at least - by someone ) with minimal distress to that oem lacquer.

M4 = .1566" major diameter, compared to SAE 8 - which is .1640", so the M4 screws are around .075" or so smaller (at the outer tips of the threading).

As far as turns per inch is concerned, the .75mm converts to .0295" compared to (SAE) 32 (being .03125").

...so - with the major diameter (ok: "pointy tips") of the threads of the Yamaha finger buttons defining a NARROWER size than 8-32 - PLUS the fact that the turns per inch is pretty darn close, AND the fact that brass is soft - makes the Yamaha M4 x .75 ability to be coaxed into 8-32 stems (particular if taking it slow and easy) viable.

[Sousaswag]

Tiny finger buttons…

I forgot to ask. I’ve seen some put Yamaha buttons on these tubas. Are they a direct fit or does the stem need to be modified?

The Yamaha brass seems to be a relatively soft yellow brass alloy, the stems (if oem) are probably 8-32 SAE, and I've always been able (going back-and-forth carefully - taking my time) to get the M4 x .75 Yamaha buttons to be "convinced" into the 8-32 SAE stem threads.

The "professional" Yamaha buttons sport (genuine) mop pearls.

...and (again) please don't strip that bell lacquer. That bell can be smoothed out (at least - by someone ) with minimal distress to that oem lacquer.

Thanks. I’ll see what I can do with those buttons.

I won’t - the bell will stay as it is!

[bloke]

I added a not-very-technical-at-all explanation as to why the Yamaha buttons can be made to fit the Holton oem stems, and why that particular metric thread is the best choice (if one finds it necessary to chose a metric thread to coax into SAE 8-32)...but (well...) even though not technical, it's STILL boring.

- Machinists cringe.
- Holton/Olds/Reynolds/King (King/Reynolds: if top caps are swapped out to Olds/Bach) owners smile.

[Sousaswag]

Case acquired. We’ll be rocking the BIG ProTec bag as it seems to be the only thing outside of an $800 Cronkhite to fit this thing.

It’s not ideal; I don’t even really like these bags, but SOMETHING is better than nothing. I’ll likely just carry this thing with the handles rather than the backpack straps.

I’ll still be in this horn after repairs, case, odds n’ ends, WAY less than I could be.

[bloke]

If no lacquer line around that mouthpipe, I'm going to have to begin to wonder if that instrument has been refinished.

That mouthpipe could well be hand-bent, but - if not - it seems reminiscent of the BMB mouthpipe contour.

[Mary Ann]

ProTec, Wessex. Thanks.

I’d love to find a used Altieri… Those things fit ANYTHING. Anyone? Anyone?

That VMI I have sitting here has a new-looking Altieri. Since that is the only bag that works for my height, I'm almost ready to make an offer on the tuba just so I can have the bag!!! I find it funny that the two other owners of my Star did not like that bag and were happy to get rid of it to me.

Further comment: I think anyone who works on tents could make an Altieri-like bag if given the materials. Industrial sewing machine and fabric and padding.

Another further comment: a truly kiddie-sized sleeping bag would also work, if you didn't need it to have backpack straps. I think just some hold-down type straps could be maneuvered into some kind of shoulder strap, two wrapped around about 18" apart and one looped through those for over the shoulder. And there was that guy who just padded the inside of a wheeled garbage can; I think he actually used that to take his MW 182 F through airline baggage and it survived.

[peterbas]

.

[Sousaswag]

Miraphone bags are some of the best.
Have an Altieri for Conn 2Xj, doesn't even come close.

I love the Miraphone bags, but the issue is the Holton is so big that nothing Miraphone offers fits, as far as I know.

That’s what I like about the Altieri bags. Since there’s no true bell cover (mostly), they can fit big tubas even if they were made for a slightly smaller bell.

[Sousaswag]

Tuba has returned from Keith's shop! Finally had the chance to play it today.

First: A shameless plug. Keith does *stellar* work to all my instruments. He's the man! And makes super finger buttons. If you're in Chicagoland and need someone you can trust, give him a ring.

Anyway, the tuba:

Reachable dents mostly gone. What's left would require disassembly. The bell turned out great. It's scarred, but it is fine. I don't really care. It's from 1966. Whatever.

The mouthpipe: Mostly de-dented and round. To my understanding this is a Euro shank receiver. I have no Euro mouthpieces. What I've got right now is PT-shank. I'll put some Euro stuff into it when I can and see what I think.

Currently, I'm using a MRP 5.0, or my Parker Titan. The MRP fits better. The Baer MMX I have doesn't fit at all. (Side note, those Giddings American shanks seem just a touch smaller than what I'm accustomed to. I've had this happen before.)

Characteristics:

Pitch is about what is normal on these. Flat F below the staff. It got better as I played it. VERY flat C in the staff. Also got better as I played it, but not right on the money. (1-3 is fine).

Everything else, though, is really quite good. First slide needs some manipulation. It's not totally dialed in to where I'd say this tuba is perfect and I can totally work it in-tune, but it DOES move, probably way better than most of these things. I can move it and play, but I'd like it to be uber-smooth.

The low notes: Great. Really great. Low F, E, they feel like they would on a 4v tuba. (OR, maybe, since I haven't played a BBb tuba seriously in like 8 years, I'm just decent enough at the tuba to know what it needs)!

The SOUND: Yeah. This is why people like these tubas. I can't wait to get it into a big hall. Wow. I've never played a totally huge BBb 6/4 other than a 20J (not for me), and I get why these are so popular now. What a gorgeous sound these tubas can make.

The whole BBb thing: Yeah. This is harder to play than C tuba. Why are we playing this length as kids?? It's hard!! C makes everything cleaner to my ear. Yes, my Tuono is more in-tune than this tuba, but articulations, slurs, attacks, everything requires less work and precision from me as the dumb guy behind the horn.

That, coupled with the sheer size of this tuba, make me "think" about how I'm going to play this tuba. Buzz accuracy, technique, it all feels like I need to go back to the basics and play "easy" stuff again. In order to be accustomed to this tuba, it's back to the basics for me. I'd like to use this instrument in my band rehearsals and maybe even some concerts. It won't be a Tuono replacement. But, on some big concerts I think it would be more than suitable. I think it's usable, but I need to work harder to know what the quirks are and, really, how to play BBb again.

I can do it. It's not "hard to play" but it is different. Less agile.

That's all for now. I've only played it an hour or so at home. My students have some sings coming up, so I won't be able to play it as much as I'd like to for the next few weeks. I'll update here as I feel is needed. Until then, know I'm quite happy with how this instrument is turning out. For what I have into it, I'm one happy guy.

[

[

[
Replaced the springs with Yamaha springs. These are what came out of the tuba. Look at the size of these! Oh so heavy. The Yamahas are much lighter and work just fine.

[bloke]

looks good.

If you figure out how far up (actual position - not "how much you need to 'pull' it") the first slide bow needs to be in order to play low E (1-2-3) in tune, you could then calculate how far IN it needs to be to play second space C in tune, and - after you've figured out those things - you could go back to your friend and ask him to shorten the outside #1 slide tubes as much as needed (and the inside slide tubes as little as necessary) and explore WHETHER there is a viable RANGE (once very thoughtful cutting is done) whereby the #1 slide could be pushed IN far enough to play the second-space C in tune, and YET pulled OUT far enough to play the low E 1-2-3 in tune...

perhaps not, but I'd certainly favor the C over the low E (as those are likely the sharpest and flattest "fixable" pitches on the instrument).

I would imagine (per my own experiences) that "low E-flat" and below (false tones) are "sousaphone good" (ie. excellent).

Kelly has a clear lexan euro shank PT-50 knockoff for $61 plus shipping/handling. At least - years ago, they charged a good bit more than actual shipping cost - at least, to me. (actual 1st class - today (padded enveloped) - would be about $5, and actual Priority ins. would be about $10.50)

[Sousaswag]

looks good.

If you figure out how far up (actual position - not "how much you need to 'pull' it") the first slide bow needs to be in order to play low E (1-2-3) in tune, you could then calculate how far IN it needs to be to play second space C in tune, and - after you've figured out those things - you could go back to your friend and ask him to shorten the outside #1 slide tubes as much as needed (and the inside slide tubes as little as necessary) and explore WHETHER there is a viable RANGE (once very thoughtful cutting is done) whereby the #1 slide could be pushed IN far enough to play the second-space C in tune, and YET pulled OUT far enough to play the low E 1-2-3 in tune...

perhaps not, but I'd certainly favor the C over the low E (as those are likely the sharpest and flattest "fixable" pitches on the instrument).

I would imagine (per my own experiences) that "low E-flat" and below (false tones) are "sousaphone good" (ie. excellent).

That is certainly a possibility, yes. All the way in, it's still pretty flat. I'll see how it does as I play it more the next few months.

You are correct. False tones are excellent on this instrument.

[bloke]

@Sousaswag

just to let you know...I edited (added to) the previous post, as you were responding.

[tofu]

[

[BRS]

.

[Sousaswag]

@tofu

Check out his Facebook page. You can see his work there - Keith Polito Brass Repair.

His website doesn’t give much info. He’s been my go-to guy since about 2021. I’m not sure how long he’s been in Elgin with his own space.

https://www.facebook.com/share/p/4s9Sog ... tid=WC7FNe

Speaking of, he posted my tuba on his page. Here’s the link.

[Sousaswag]

First rehearsal with this instrument was a roller coaster.

Initially, I played it with a small group, which was dumb. VERY exposed, in the key of E, it was a lot for a first time 6/4, and BBb, rehearsal. I found it very hard to match pitch with my section mate, and play in tune all together. I was worried.

Then I realized, I also had the wrong mouthpiece.

That change made ALL the difference.

This tuba has a Euro receiver, and until yesterday I had no true Euro mouthpieces. My MRP 5.0 was the biggest I had, and even that is a P shank.

My section mate is selling off a few things, namely some Parker setups, and gave me first dibs. I plugged in a Hitz cup with a Euro shank, and a Helleberg rim, and wow!

Mouthpiece sensitive, these big guys are! Now, I can play first valve C up to pitch. That F is still flat, and 2-3 F# is also flat if low C is in tune. However voodoo this might sound, having the correct shank size seems to be a big deal.

I also received the ProTec bag. It fits, and that bag is HUGE. I can barely squeeze it in the back seat of my Quad Cab Ram. With the bed cover I use, I’m worried that the bell is actually too tall with that cover on. I need to do some messing around.

I recorded some video that I’ll get up on YouTube later after work.

When correctly set up, these tubas are really something.

[arpthark]

It is always an enlightening experience to throw yourself into a rehearsal situation with a new tuba, and it quickly illuminates the strengths and weaknesses of the new instrument, especially if it is radically different than the one you are used to.

[Sousaswag]

Update...

Got the horn out last week. Here is a clip I recorded with my iPhone playing the La Peri Fanfare.

Generally, I'm happy with how this tuba performed. Needs tweaking, but my section mates really enjoy the sound it makes, as do I. I think this sounds nice.

[