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the elephant wrote: ↑Sat Apr 22, 2023 11:43 am Yeah, I consider this all the time, but my job situation won't really allow me to do that. So I plod along through life, dragging a big CC, a medium CC, and a big F along with me.

I always thought the Big CC was a requirement for the symphony, but every time I bring the medium sized horn to a rehearsal, I always get random people coming up to me on break telling me how great the smaller tuba sounds. I never should have sold my Piggy, it was pretty much the best of both worlds

Currently I own 6 tubas. I'm trying to sell three so I can make room for a new one which I'll buy from Bloke.

Schlepporello wrote: ↑Sun Apr 23, 2023 6:14 am Currently I own 6 tubas. I'm trying to sell three so I can make room for a new one which I'll buy from Bloke.

I don't know if this is a serious comment, but I myself recently sold three or so to buy myself one.
Even though I sold the C tuba that I owned, that wasn't part of the formula, but was sold afterwards when I realized that it would probably mostly just end up sitting.

My prediction... He wants a Packer 179

bloke wrote: ↑Sun Apr 23, 2023 8:46 am

Schlepporello wrote: ↑Sun Apr 23, 2023 6:14 am Currently I own 6 tubas. I'm trying to sell three so I can make room for a new one which I'll buy from Bloke.

I don't know if this is a serious comment, but I myself recently sold three or so to buy myself one.
Even though I sold the C tuba that I owned, that wasn't part of the formula, but was sold afterwards when I realized that it would probably mostly just end up sitting.

Yep, it's serious. I may have one sold next Saturday.

LeMark wrote: ↑Sat Apr 22, 2023 11:46 am

the elephant wrote: ↑Sat Apr 22, 2023 11:43 am Yeah, I consider this all the time, but my job situation won't really allow me to do that. So I plod along through life, dragging a big CC, a medium CC, and a big F along with me.

I always thought the Big CC was a requirement for the symphony, but every time I bring the medium sized horn to a rehearsal, I always get random people coming up to me on break telling me how great the smaller tuba sounds. I never should have sold my Piggy, it was pretty much the best of both worlds

Just an observation by someone who claims no particular knowledge.

In most activities there’s a Goldilocks or best spot, it’s not always obvious though.

Up to their peak output slightly smaller bore instruments use noticeably less air than larger bore instruments. Bigger instruments played hard sound louder than small instruments played hard. The relationship of perceived sound to air consumption is not linear, twice as much air sounds much less than twice as loud. A smaller bore instrument is easier to drive and arguably more sonorous than a bigger instrument.

So if someone is after sound quality rather than sound quantity then they might well be better off playing a smaller rather than larger Tuba. I claim no expertise and that’s just my observation, it is one though that I’ve occasionally seen elsewhere.

Orchestras program different repertoire, but my F tuba (which I've always considered to be my primary instrument, the one that I'm not even aware of when I'm playing it, and the one that I can read without thinking when playing it) is staying home more and more, and not really because I wouldn't like to use it. I love using it.

I'm playing more and more pops (no comment), so the cimbasso gets loaded really often, and almost tiresomely so.

I threw up a video of a covid era one-rehearsal/one-time-through Organ Symphony performance whereby I decided to bring my F tuba, since I had played it on that instrument years ago (when it was my only tuba... Oh my God, bloke.. It has some of those 'dreaded low C's' it...You must be crazy ). Anyway, I didn't see anyone post that they couldn't hear it over the organ.

More recently, I used the F on (all of) Mahler 1, as I've been seeing people on videos switch back and forth. It made plenty of racket when it was time to make plenty of racket.

I've also stated that when ophicleide parts are handed to me with "tuba" printed at the top these days, I'm using my euphonium, so maybe it's my own fault that the F tuba is mostly staying home.

When I first owned Fat Bastard and it had some stuff with it that wasn't right at all that I hadn't uncovered yet, it played that tuba solo in that Saving Private Ryan tune without any blurbs (Is it called "Hymn to the Fallen", or have I mixed up names with some other tune?), and that behemoth has just gotten better as I've uncovered its little problems and changed some things to make other things easier.

As posted less than an hour ago in another thread, I'm mostly just a goof.

I'm convinced that if you play in an orchestra long enough you will encounter music where you wish you had a bigger (or smaller) instrument for a given work. I played with a local orchestra for 30 years and most of the time I was able to long-term borrow an F or Eb tuba when needed, work up the part, and was all set (the DC area has more professional tuba players per capita than any place in the world, so it's easy to make friends). Yes, there were times in there when I owned an Eb or an F but really didn't need to keep one.

So, IMHO, there's no issue with owning one tuba *IF* there is a reasonable avenue to get your hands on something you don't have for a particular work for a short period of time.

I only have one tuba. I barely have time to practice it as my job takes a lot of my time.It was easier when I was in school to play trombone,euphonium, and tuba.

I do need to thin the herd, but don't think I will even get down to one unless the nursing home insists I don't realistically see getting down to less than 3-4 anytime in the near future, because I leave one at community band and one at church so I don't have to schlep them around.

yikes...
I hope they are each worth less than $100 and/or you are the only person that has the key to those well-armored storage rooms.

bloke wrote: ↑Thu Apr 20, 2023 8:15 am With (at least) a few tubas that are each more suited to various types of music, I'm able to fool some people into believing that I'm competent.

russiantuba, likely: directed at Mark wrote:What horn do you use for quintet type performances?

Cimbasso (a non-crappy easily-able-to-be-played-in-tune one) might (??) be the best instrument for most brass quintet playing, but - as so few have experienced that - I can't possibly expect very many at all to agree with this...

I "get" the bass trombone thing, but bass trombones are just a little too small (almost "faking" being a bass instrument with not much more than extra tubing), and so many tubas (most?) tend to make a quintet sound somewhat like "four brass and and electric bass" - rather than five equal voices. The cimbasso voice sounds more like a low version of the other voices. ...and yes, the problem is that so many of them are difficult to play in tune (or - simply - difficult to play).

Here's a Renaissance transcription that I performed live with the Mississippi Brass Quintet (Ole Miss) a few years ago...
I was using my F tuba. I practically had to "whisper" to achieve this balance and avoid sounding (what I refer to as) "hooty".
Cimbasso would have been PERFECT, and would have blended better with the trumpets and trombones...

I found an oversized mp really helped me sound more appropriate when playing bass trombone in brass quintet and brass choir, I'd like to try it in my comp euph in brass quintet. I don't play as big on my Eb bass thing as I did on bass trombone, I bet it could still work. My Kanstul F contra was a much bigger horn, I had intentions of playing that in brass quintet.

I haven't played in a group in years but have always thought a full-size Eb and a bass trombone would easily cover all the playing I used to do. I don't currently have an Eb I can play in polite company and I can't play the chainsaw anymore.

Now that I am 76, I recently have "downsized" my stable to 1 tuba, which is a MW 3450 CC: compact size, enough "output" for wind orchestra, flexible enough for quintet (the outstanding flexibility of the 3450 rivals that of a big F-tuba). So, I do not regret, makes life easier....
Hubert

I'd say if you feel good with one tuba then all the power to you.
Less practicing (on the other tuba).
Less maintenance.
The less axes the more proficient you are on what you do play (theoretically speaking).

I prefer myself to have two of everything, just in case one breaks down.
Just a thought.

LeMark wrote: ↑Sat Apr 22, 2023 11:46 am

the elephant wrote: ↑Sat Apr 22, 2023 11:43 am Yeah, I consider this all the time, but my job situation won't really allow me to do that. So I plod along through life, dragging a big CC, a medium CC, and a big F along with me.

I always thought the Big CC was a requirement for the symphony, but every time I bring the medium sized horn to a rehearsal, I always get random people coming up to me on break telling me how great the smaller tuba sounds. I never should have sold my Piggy, it was pretty much the best of both worlds

This is the whole clarity vs. breadth dichotomy. But for me it depends on the space, and my colleagues are not really "out front".

My issue is that I lack the air power to play really loudly on a small tuba without it turning into a weapon of destruction. Also, when I play high music, the shakes reduce the accuracy of my buzz, and the more widely spaced partials of a bass tuba really help. Sure, if I was better, I could do those things on any tuba. But I'm not, and at this stage of life things are going backwards, not forwards in many dimensions. Specialization in the fleet helps cover for lack of ability to specialize in the chops.

The tubas I own now treat my weaknesses with respect in the situations where I use them.

Good tools do that--multiply our efforts. We can talk all we want about the danger of power tools and the care required in their use, and we should. In the shop, I could do everything with chisels, scrapers, a handsaw, and files, given enough time, practice, and skill. But time is in short supply and power saws, lathes, drills, grinders, etc., improve my productivity given what I am able to bring to the table. (They improve the productivity of masters, too, which is why they exist.)

So, I'm happy with my five Bb and two F tubas. :)

Rick "I think that's the current count" Denney

I've said this too many times, but I have different tubas that have different strengths to fool people into thinking that I play better than I do.

Every once in awhile, I'll grab one that doesn't seem to be the obvious choice, just to remind myself that they all will work (and in particular, the F tuba) for most anything. An example that I've posted here was an mp4 of me using my F tuba to play the Saint Saens Organ Symphony.

The 98 B-flat is the best extra large tuba I've ever played, but I would sell it before I would sell the F.

RE: cimbasso in brass quintet.
Seems to me there are two "ends" of instrumentation in a brass quintet, depending on the literature being played. Our quintet is on the mellow end, with two cornets, French horn, euphonium (me,) and NStar.
The other end would be two trumpets (probably C trumpets,) French horn, trombone, and either bass tbone or cimbasso.

You would / could get wildly different outputs with those combos. I can't think of a non-conical French horn replacement though. A really competent British baritone player could do most horn parts though, were they willing.

I of course out of my usual curiosity would love to have at a good cimbasso, but think it a bit late in the game for that now. At least I'd be able to hold it up, as opposed to a bass tbone, which I can't.

I think most of us can reasonably get by with one tuba. Whatever key you choose. Personally, I could do everything on my large F tuba. But, there are times when I want the sound of the C. So, I have two. Kids these days don't yet understand that the vast majority of playing after school will NOT by the 80-piece orchestra.

For quintet, community band, random sub gigs, church, etc, etc, 99% of the time my F tuba is fine. Perfectly fine.

More people should probably consider comp. Eb's

When I've posted some studio recordings of a jazz band I worked with back in the early 1980's that guy played a cornet with a funnel cup...and his sound was anything but "mellow" - even though his equipment was designed to play with a "mellow" sound.

I'm pretty sure there are quite a few people who can coax different types of sounds out not-that-dissimilar instruments.
I'm thinking a Miraphone 186 and a B&S F tuba can be made to sound quite similar...and even a compensating E-flat.

I'd probably had a really difficult time getting Fat Bastard and my F cimbasso to sound the same.

I use my F cimbasso (in quintet recitals) nearly exclusively to play Renaissance transcriptions, because its "voice" sounds more like the other instruments (rather than a "bass" instrument). I'll use my F tuba playing brass quintet Baroque transcriptions, because many off those are organ pieces, and the F tuba doesn't sound dissimilar to the "peddle" range of an organ.

I used the F tuba on those jazz band studio recordings. Most people guess that I was usually a considerably larger tuba...because I was working (and not with any special/different mouthpiece) to achieve that type of sound...and I used it because (at that time) it was the only tuba that I had not sold off. (I had walked away from a university tuba-teaching job, and was - at that time - playing about 65% bass gigs, and about 35% tuba gigs.)

If you'll excuse the injection of a bit of levity (ie. a silly song...), here's a pretty good example (from that session) of the F tuba sounding like bigger tuba (because I wished it to) and the cornet sounding much brighter that the typical concept of a cornet sound (because he wished it to)...

...and yes, you're hearing a 4-string "tenor guitar" - tuned in fifths.


I'm working with the same pianist and banjo player this Sunday...They are 90 and 85 years old.