TubaForum.net

arpthark wrote: ↑Fri Jun 30, 2023 9:40 am

Mary Ann wrote: ↑Fri Jun 30, 2023 9:36 am

matt g wrote: ↑Thu Jun 29, 2023 4:52 pm Dillon Music has a new 185 in stock:

https://www.dillonmusic.com/miraphone-model-85-cc-tuba/

I think someone play tested that one and found truly awful intonation problems, a while back.

Paging @tubanh84

If that is the same one then yes. I wouldn't go near it. Tried a lot of mouthpieces on it. Not one that made the intonation workable.

bloke wrote: ↑Fri Jun 30, 2023 12:32 pm You might look for a GOOD CONDITION vintage (16-1/2 bell) FOUR VALVE (pick you length - B-flat or C) Miraphone 186 (handmade/sheet metal).

Those are going weigh less than your jimbo for two reasons:

- sheet metal
- one less valve

...and you'll still have a full-size-sounding tuba.

If you think a 19.6mm bore size is too large, just use a MOUTHPIECE with a SMALLER THROAT SIZE.

-------------------------------------
When I'm using my cimbasso on pops concerts (and peeling paint, at the appropriate moments), some people think I'm working my @$$ off...
I'm using a mouthpiece with the equivalent of a large bass trombone mouthpiece throat size.
I end all of those concerts with dry T-shirts.

Mirafone 186 CC 4v small bell.....from the 60's....can't go wrong...

LeMark wrote: ↑Thu Jun 29, 2023 7:20 pm It's not rotary , it if it wanted a small CC I would snag one of those mack brass Yamaha 621 copies. Norm Epley has the real thing for sale, and I'm going to be at his house in a week

Are those better than the Amati? The Amati is larger than the 184, but the weight is about the same.

We'll find out. I'll play the one at norm's next week if he still has it. They were good enough for the Canadian brass for years

[

Why not tell why >>> you <<< like it, rather than defending it with others' ownership?

The same people mention own(ed) instruments (whether for a few years or quite a few years) that I would never consider buying/using...

ex's;
...a model 80 F cut to G...an 822 double tuba...a model 90C...a York 4/4 C...

I briefly owned a Mirafone 185 from the early 70's. It is hands down the best horn I have ever played. That being said, I have had hand issues since about 30 years old. I'm 50 now and starting to develop some shoulder issues. The original poster is looking for something small with a small bore. This has been my issue for years. My hands require short stroke rotors which usually means small bore. Horns like the Piggy won't work. I have owned one and the rotor throw is too long. I found my perfect solution in a Mirafone 184 built in the mid 80's and once owned by Dana Hofer. The intonation is really solid, the rotor throw is short, and the spacing and length of the rotor paddles fit my hand perfectly. This is the first horn I have owned in the past 20 years that hasn't caused me much hand pain. I also had a 3/4 Rudy when I played professionally. Probably more rare than the 184 and much more expensive. It was also excellent for my hands and comfortable to hold. I would bet the 184 is best price and best fit. I will definitely keep my eyes open. BTW I bought mine for $3500 so they can be had at a reasonable cost. There were 3 for sale when I bought mine. They do come around from time to time.

Knowing that those joint issues will not get any better over the years I would think about this one:
https://jestaedt-instrumente.de/instrumente/tuebchen/
I have played them and heard them played by good players, these horns are great. Only a bit more chamber-music-sized. But you get a full tuba with the weight of modern euphonium. And being hand-made you can order a custom height leadpipe.
This would be my choice for a lightweight tuba, if I had to chose one. Luckily my 1909 SBF F tuba has only 6 kgs as well! (same weight as the french C!!)

I just wanted to chime in on the 4 rotor suggestion --- people squeak about needing a fifth rotor. My recent Miraphone Ebs, both of them, have a very useable false tone on Ab. No, it's not as secure as having valves down, but if you can securely play that pitch, it can work very well. I was actually considering the only new Star I could find, which was in Europe somewhere, and it was a four rotor. My friend who also plays a Star, screeched that I'd have terrible trouble selling it; I said, I don't care because it is going in the coffin with me, and I will never have to sell it. Then I got my Star back and, for that low Ab especially in the oompah range, the false tone is just as easy as having three rotors down, although with a different feel. A real connoisseur listener type could probably tell the difference, but not yer avg listener.

That 184 5U CC I bought a while back has been sitting since I got the Star back. I'll go dig it out of the back bedroom and see if I still want it. If the OP is interested, perhaps we could get on Zoom and talk about it with a show and tell.

And -- that 4 valve older-but-nicely-modified 183 Eb is the lightest tuba I've ever played, with an open low range using that false tone. Not physically pretty but zero complaints. Those are probably more scarce than 184s when modified with a standard receiver. That one, though, I still play in venues that I don't want to expose the Star to.

Mary Ann wrote: ↑Sat Jul 01, 2023 8:14 am That 184 5U CC I bought a while back has been sitting since I got the Star back. I'll go dig it out of the back bedroom and see if I still want it. If the OP is interested, perhaps we could get on Zoom and talk about it with a show and tell.

I agree with you on the 5th valve. The only reason I have one is because the Mack was not available without one. For my community band and ensemble use, I really use it very little. While I knew the 5th valve added weight, I was surprised at how much weight it adds.

If you decide to let go of the 184, I would like very much to talk to you about it.

Jim, I have a 3/4 Weril CC. It is a very small yamaclone of the small CC Yamaha. It is a 4 valve piston horn but gets the job done when needed.

Those 1970's Meister Gerhard Schneider (B&S) C tubas (imported by Selmer USA) were 4-rotor instruments, sheet metal, featured 16-1/2 inch bells, were just a bit smaller than 186 tubas, and sported a 19mm bore (roughly 2% less circular area in the bore, compared to the 186 bore).

' pretty good/not commonly seen offered for sale...