PH is 1000x the tuba player I am, and I am impressed by his musicianship.
But, my frank opinion, the sound is a bit oinky, isn't it? And I think that is much more the compensating eefer than PH.
I wouldn't call it oinky, but the instrument is what it is. It's a bass tuba which has been big-i-fied to "make do" on contrabass rep. The low register of a compensating Eb takes a little different blow to it, but it's easy to figure out and make it go.
If you have the opportunity to spend some time with such an instrument, you might not want to give it back.
The only "sorta" negative thing I've got to say about those 19 inch belled Eb tubas is they always want to sound pretty. A lot like a 3+1 compensated euphonium. One has to work to put edge or gruffness into the sound if that's what you want to get out of it. The 15 inch ones have gruffness in spades.
The 19 inch bell English made Bessons have a very captivating sound. It's just lovely. Not that any of the others makers' models don't sound good, but there's something special about the English Bessons. I don't know if the current German made Bessons have that.
A 19 inch bell 3+1 compensated Eb might just be the ultimate "old man" or "retirement" tuba.
Re: Eb vs F tuba in an orchestra to the tubists ears
PH is 1000x the tuba player I am, and I am impressed by his musicianship.
But, my frank opinion, the sound is a bit oinky, isn't it? And I think that is much more the compensating eefer than PH.
I wouldn't call it oinky, but the instrument is what it is. It's a bass tuba which has been big-i-fied to "make do" on contrabass rep. The low register of a compensating Eb takes a little different blow to it, but it's easy to figure out and make it go.
If you have the opportunity to spend some time with such an instrument, you might not want to give it back.
The only "sorta" negative thing I've got to say about those 19 inch belled Eb tubas is they always want to sound pretty. A lot like a 3+1 compensated euphonium. One has to work to put edge or gruffness into the sound if that's what you want to get out of it. The 15 inch ones have gruffness in spades.
The 19 inch bell English made Bessons have a very captivating sound. It's just lovely. Not that any of the others makers' models don't sound good, but there's something special about the English Bessons. I don't know if the current German made Bessons have that.
A 19 inch bell 3+1 compensated Eb might just be the ultimate "old man" or "retirement" tuba.
I have owned a Besson 15" bell 3+1 (which I loved) and also one of the 19" bell clones which I used in a British-style brass band.
I definitely preferred the 15". Agreed about the 19" bell -- a very pretty, puffy, nice, toot-toot sort of sound. I can't say I liked it. I bought it as a "do-everything" tuba and it did everything, but I ultimately sold it because I just couldn't quite get the sort of sound I wanted on it.
I'm sure everyone else thought "wow, that sounds like a tuba."
Re: Eb vs F tuba in an orchestra to the tubists ears
Mary Ann wrote: ↑Wed Oct 26, 2022 6:37 pm
I didn't realize the tuba part to the Ride was so low. My Eb will do that but not sure I can with recognizable pitches.
IIRC, The lowest note is a low E. If you still have one of the Miraphone star models, that's all 5 valves down on your Eb, a half step above the pedal Eb (you probably knew all that already).
I no longer have my NStar; I now have a Miraphone 183 Eb that has an excellent false tone on Ab between the pedal and the Eb above the pedal, and the low E is easily played with 23. It is more open in the low register than the NStar was, and in terms of low register I find I actually prefer it.
Re: Eb vs F tuba in an orchestra to the tubists ears
I have owned a Besson 15" bell 3+1 (which I loved) and also one of the 19" bell clones which I used in a British-style brass band.
I definitely preferred the 15". Agreed about the 19" bell -- a very pretty, puffy, nice, toot-toot sort of sound. I can't say I liked it. I bought it as a "do-everything" tuba and it did everything, but I ultimately sold it because I just couldn't quite get the sort of sound I wanted on it.
I'm sure everyone else thought "wow, that sounds like a tuba."
If I were to encounter a 15 inch belled Besson 3+1 Eb with really good valves, I think I'd be pretty eager to pick it up if my finances cooperated.
Given that all of these things are decades old and I live in the US, I have no confidence that this will happen.
I am however very pleased with my Yamaha 631 Eb with its 17.5 inch bell. It seems to be everything that all those modern oversized F tubas wished they were.
Re: Eb vs F tuba in an orchestra to the tubists ears
PH is 1000x the tuba player I am, and I am impressed by his musicianship.
But, my frank opinion, the sound is a bit oinky, isn't it? And I think that is much more the compensating eefer than PH.
I wouldn't call it oinky, but the instrument is what it is. It's a bass tuba which has been big-i-fied to "make do" on contrabass rep. The low register of a compensating Eb takes a little different blow to it, but it's easy to figure out and make it go.
If you have the opportunity to spend some time with such an instrument, you might not want to give it back.
The only "sorta" negative thing I've got to say about those 19 inch belled Eb tubas is they always want to sound pretty. A lot like a 3+1 compensated euphonium. One has to work to put edge or gruffness into the sound if that's what you want to get out of it. The 15 inch ones have gruffness in spades.
The 19 inch bell English made Bessons have a very captivating sound. It's just lovely. Not that any of the others makers' models don't sound good, but there's something special about the English Bessons. I don't know if the current German made Bessons have that.
A 19 inch bell 3+1 compensated Eb might just be the ultimate "old man" or "retirement" tuba.
I have owned a Besson 15" bell 3+1 (which I loved) and also one of the 19" bell clones which I used in a British-style brass band.
I definitely preferred the 15". Agreed about the 19" bell -- a very pretty, puffy, nice, toot-toot sort of sound. I can't say I liked it. I bought it as a "do-everything" tuba and it did everything, but I ultimately sold it because I just couldn't quite get the sort of sound I wanted on it.
I'm sure everyone else thought "wow, that sounds like a tuba."
I really like that “pungent” sound of the 19” bell on my Packer- it’s the British sound I have in my head. My 15” B&H Imperial does not have that type of sound, but I like it very much also. Smaller and sweeter. The Imperial’s valves are not perfect (some scratches), but they aren’t pitted. And they work. I like the tuba enough that I might like to have a valve job done to make it like new, but I’m not sure who is doing piston valves these days.
Re: Eb vs F tuba in an orchestra to the tubists ears
Posted: Sat Oct 29, 2022 9:01 pm
by bloke
Speaking of pungent, I believe I will run out before Walmart closes and buy some feta cheese and some blue cheese.
Hey Bill, I have the case. Thank you!
Re: Eb vs F tuba in an orchestra to the tubists ears
Posted: Sat Oct 29, 2022 9:11 pm
by Tuba1153
Doc wrote: ↑Fri Oct 28, 2022 9:41 pm
I really like that “pungent” sound of the 19” bell on my Packer- it’s the British sound I have in my head.
That horn has a phat sound!! Looking forward to hearing it in my ear at zero dark thirty tomorrow morning.
Re: Eb vs F tuba in an orchestra to the tubists ears
Doc wrote: ↑Fri Oct 28, 2022 9:41 pm
I really like that “pungent” sound of the 19” bell on my Packer- it’s the British sound I have in my head.
That horn has a phat sound!! Looking forward to hearing it in my ear at zero dark thirty tomorrow morning.
Yes sir. At the ass crack of dawn.
Gonna be a goodern!
Re: Eb vs F tuba in an orchestra to the tubists ears
Posted: Sat Oct 29, 2022 9:50 pm
by Doc
bloke wrote: ↑Sat Oct 29, 2022 9:01 pm
Speaking of pungent, I believe I will run out before Walmart closes and buy some feta cheese and some blue cheese.
Hey Bill, I have the case. Thank you!
Happy to help. Glad it all worked out like it did.
I hope you can help my compadre with his tuba woes.
Re: Eb vs F tuba in an orchestra to the tubists ears
Posted: Sun Oct 30, 2022 7:53 am
by bloke
His old B&S C tuba doesn’t play all that sharp, but it will when most of the time he plays it outdoors in community band concerts when it’s 80° to 100°.
I’ll just be fixing up his noisy rotors and linkage - and removing some minor dents, after I figure out where to make the instrument longer.
Leaving my freeway philharmonic gig yesterday evening, I got piled on with several trombone repairs.
(That was the one where I drove back-and-forth after every rehearsal in the concert, so I could do work back here at blokeplace - rather than sitting in a hotel room.
It was nine hours of driving, but 30 minutes south of home was some only three dollar gas. so I paid $60 for all of that gas versus my $85 hotel allowance. As far as the nine hours of driving, I really can’t count that as far as labor is concerned, because I gained working time at home versus – again – languishing in a hotel room.
(This may all seem to be a non sequitur, but I wouldn’t have been able to meet and discuss the repairs with your friend, had I not driven home one of those times.)
Re: Eb vs F tuba in an orchestra to the tubists ears
@Doc Just wonderin' what combination of Sellmansberger mouthpiece parts is suiting you on the Packer Eb?
Re: Eb vs F tuba in an orchestra to the tubists ears
Posted: Mon Oct 31, 2022 9:50 am
by Mary Ann
I find I know about nothing about this piece --- the only orchestral parts I find on imslp have wagner tuba parts (horn players) but no "tuba tuba" part that I can find. And I was not able to find that particular excerpt looking at the parts but maybe I missed it. That WOULD be VERY low for a Wagner tuba using a horn mouthpiece, and certainly would not project like a tuba would. What am I missing?
And, finally, what key is this in? The first note of the excerpt is either an F# or a Gb depending on how it is notated, and I don't know what key to put it in if I have to transcribe it. (I already have it in my own "transcription notation" but my tuba friend wants to work it up and he can't read that kind of scribbling.)
Re: Eb vs F tuba in an orchestra to the tubists ears
