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This is a consignment instrument.
We put it in good playing/selling/gig-ready condition, but didn't go overboard on the cosmetics (the original lacquer is quite worn), as we couldn't run up some huge repair bill (just for "shiny") with the instrument's owner.

The spec's of the vintage version of the 186 are widely known, but are as follows:
19.6mm valveset bore
420mm bell diameter
nickel silver outside slide tubing
brass inside slide tubing
brass mouthpipe tube

Being made in 1969, this is a "hand-made"/sheet metal tuba. The advertised price will purchase it immediately, but we would have an obligation to present offers - within a reasonable range - to the owner.
For comparison, this is only about a THIRD of the no-case-included widely advertised price for a brand new one (with new ones being mostly fabricated of hydraulically-formed bows: reference: https://www.wwbw.com/Miraphone-186-4U-S ... 26000.wwbw

We DID remove just about any/all existing denting...I guess really tiny dents are what some refer to as "pings". (I tend to label anything a "dent".) The instrument has a few little "pings", but we've straightened it all out very well. The repairs (as well as past dent removal) are apparent (ie. NOT filed/sanded/buffed - ALL of the metal is there.)

There's a patch on the upper bow where one's thumb (if a player is not a #1 slide-puller) would tend to be placed (a place possibly worn away by past owners' thumbs?), and the patch is well done. (Of course, we'll put it in one of the pictures). There is also a patch on the #4 slide bow.

The bearing plates (#'s 1, 2, &3) have been turned on a lathe to remove vertical play. (#4 was previously free of issues.) The linkage is the original S-arm/T-joint linkage. I would rate the valves as "quiet". (Included is a short video where each of the rotors are activated.)

We also just gave this instrument a full "chem-clean" immersion cleaning.

There's not much lacquer on the bell flair, so we did a really light polishing (inside/outside) to make the bell's condition more visible in the pictures.

I do not remember working on this tuba (as I've worked on so many), but most of the work looks as if it is my own work (some time in the past?)

I would personally rate the sound/response as "exceptional" (particularly compared to many newer-vintage ones - though new ones are certainly prettier). Intonation is typical/easy/good 186 intonation.

Due to current sketchy and expensive shipping options, we're not necessarily promising to offer any services in particular, in regards to that.
We have no idea (??) if the instrument's owner might be willing to meet someone (perhaps not too far off...??) on a day off from work, and that's just a shoulder-shrugging/"who-knows?" suggestion.

We do not have pictures of the bag, and don't (at least, not yet) have any information as to the make or condition of the bag.
The hard wood case's exterior was bolstered with fiberglass and resin, and is covered with travel stickers. Thus, the hard case is EXTRA heavy. I would say the case alone (with all of the fiberglass and resin added to the exterior) is at least as heavy as a normal wood case with an instrument inside.
When we see/retrieve the bag, I'll update this ad.

First is a short video - with sound (though the sound didn't record very well - much hiss, not much volume) - of each of the valves being operated, and then quite a few pictures:

video: https://i.imgur.com/FbcLrB6.mp4

NOTE:

Unless some extenuating circumstance - or a need to re-lacquer a portion of a nicely-lacquered instrument - I prefer to sell worn-original-lacquer instruments with their remaining original lacquer on them, so as to demonstrate that (as can be possible with an instrument completely stripped of its lacquer) no one has previously "buffed an instrument to death".

With apologies for
- not being familiar with this particular instrument
- not having the music in front of me (for the correct articulations, etc.)
- phone mic

I guess I'm just trying to demonstrate that
- the thing works
- the linkage isn't noisy

Nice tuba!

The brass wore thin since there’s not a lot of reason to not just leave the hand there.

The case is a lot of fun, too.

also...
I apologize for what may seem to be a sorta high price, but - as recently as the year 2000 - I would've only asked a couple thousand bucks for this thing.
Money just ain't worth anything. We all know why, but those topics are banned, so...

It has those signature fancy lathe-turned "hard-brazed" non-adjustable braces, too.

It does. I suspect that - since they are completely set up to make those widths - those are still used on these traditional models.

Being over a half century old and not epoxy lacquered, the remaining lacquer on this instrument doesn’t offer much “sparkle“ as far as “curb appeal“ is concerned. I suspect that - with shiny lacquer - this instrument would’ve already been sold.
Many people are more impressed with “shiny“ than they are with “handmade“.

There is a special place of a vehicle in this class of condition in the car world. If a vintage car (40s-50s or older) is found having been holed up in a barn or a warehouse, frequently, it is made clean and mechanically sound, polished and used as is. If the seat covers are worn with stuffing hanging out, they are replaced and, if there are minor rust throughs, they are patched but, for the most part, they are left alone. Wiring and brake systems are made solid but the engine isn't touched unless it needs it badly. Gas tanks are usually pretty raunchy but that sort of stuff is available on the repro market at reasonable prices. And, of course, tires. Vintage reproductions are available. When carefully cleaned and polished, they look pretty good and have a special place in car shows as "originals".

This horn has a premium price but not that premium. Consider what else you can get for $3.5K and it looks pretty good. And the price was set by the consignor. This would be a great horn to own and play every day and night!

Besides the hard case, this is pretty much the dream situation for me... German made, well-established and solid, easy to play, and easy to repair when needed. Oh, and under $4k.

Years ago, I played in a band with the late Steve Harsch, whom I believe @Rick Denney also knew. He had an old 186 just like this, and sounded fantastic on it. Soft touch, big sound... It was so flexible and he could make it GO. Nice guy, was very sad to hear when he passed. But I digress... This tuba...

What's not to like?!

yep...or maybe (though cars are much more complicated, mechanically)...

It's...
- all straightened out
- mechanically sound
- mechanically quiet
- exceptionally nice-sounding
- not been buffed to kingdom-come
- NOT some needs-$1500-of-work $2000 "eBay special"

bort2.0 wrote:Besides the hard case, this is pretty much the dream situation for me... German made, well-established and solid, easy to play, and easy to repair when needed. Oh, and under $4k.

Years ago, I played in a band with the late Steve Harsch, whom I believe [mention]Rick Denney[/mention] also knew. He had an old 186 just like this, and sounded fantastic on it. Soft touch, big sound... It was so flexible and he could make it GO. Nice guy, was very sad to hear when he passed. But I digress... This tuba...

What's not to like?!

He bought a PT-1 while he was in Baltimore with you.

I once borrowed that 186 of his for some reason I can’t now recall. That had to have been 35+ years ago. Playing with Steve and Dan Augustine in the Austin Symphonic Band—that was the environment of my return to tuba playing nearly 40 years ago.

Rick “halcyon days” Denney

Rick Denney wrote: ↑Mon May 02, 2022 7:17 am ...
I once borrowed that 186 of his for some reason I can’t now recall. That had to have been 35+ years ago. Playing with Steve and Dan Augustine in the Austin Symphonic Band—that was the environment of my return to tuba playing nearly 40 years ago.

Rick “halcyon days” Denney

I saw Dan Augustine playing tuba with the Austin Polka Band yesterday. Sounded like he was having fun.

jtm wrote: ↑Mon May 02, 2022 2:21 pm

Rick Denney wrote: ↑Mon May 02, 2022 7:17 am ...
I once borrowed that 186 of his for some reason I can’t now recall. That had to have been 35+ years ago. Playing with Steve and Dan Augustine in the Austin Symphonic Band—that was the environment of my return to tuba playing nearly 40 years ago.

Rick “halcyon days” Denney

I saw Dan Augustine playing tuba with the Austin Polka Band yesterday. Sounded like he was having fun.

If you see him again, tell him I said "Hi."

We also played together (and with Steve) in the "Wurst Band" that was a pickup group on Thursday nights at Scholz' Garden. We played for beer and there was no shortage of that.

Rick "sight-reading march-sized books--our leader showed up with a box of them totaling over 700 tunes--in near-darkness requires lots of beer" Denney

I realize what an outdated old doofus I am, when some march is called up (orchestra/band/whatever) and I probably completely know that march - and not just "memorized"...and just tell the first key signature of the intro.

(in the same way that "old rockers" know ALL the oldies, and - sure - could play them in any key.)

bloke wrote: ↑Tue May 03, 2022 10:36 am I realize what an outdated old doofus I am, when some march is called up (orchestra/band/whatever) and I probably completely know that march - and not just "memorized"...and just tell the first key signature of the intro.

(in the same way that "old rockers" know ALL the oldies, and - sure - could play them in any key.)

Jim Bryan's box 'o tunes usually produced marches and polkas that I'd never heard, especially in those days.

This was long before Scholz's Garden built the stage in the Biergarten, back when Threadgill's was the food concessioner.

My first boss was old Austin (and German) and was a member of the Austin Saengerrunde Association, which bought Scholz' Garden in 1908 or some such, from the people who owned it for a few years after August Scholz died. Old stuff there.

But back to guessing at parts. If a person is the only tuba player in a group, guessing at a part is fine. But when playing with other tuba players, guessing at a part (or ad-libbing it from a memory of the tune) may show skill, but often fights what is actually written. I recall one Army conference when Sam Pilafian (RIP) was performing jazzy stuff with another group whose leader was playing a sousaphone. Both individually were consistent with the music and neither demonstrated any shortage of skill, but together it was...contentious and confusing.

Rick "do no harm when playing third fiddle" Denney

yeah...but there are actually quite a few marches to which I know (no guessing) the composed "Basses" parts...

...and - beyond memorization - "knowing" (again) it to be able to play them in any key (though as written).

I started up "King Cotton March" (a goofy two-man gig...just a trumpet player and me. He was retired from the Navy).
It's a VERY old festival now called "Carnival Memphis", as - in the past - it was called the "Cotton Carnival"...but cotton (you know: underwear jeans, etc.) is r@c!st, so...
Anyway, I started it up, and played through all the strains with him.
At the end, he say's, "You weirdo...That march starts out in E-flat and goes to A-flat!" (I had started it out in C and send to F)...
...but he "KNEW" it just as I did (all the right notes - in any key), and played the entire thing with me in C and F.



bloke "I don't 'KNOW' hundreds of old marches written parts, but do 'KNOW' dozens of them...and is there any old fart who can't play 'Stars and Stripes Forever' without looking at a piece of paper...??"

sold for ask+shipping

thnx.