TubaForum.net

What's like the F tuba equivalent of a Miraphone 188 or 186, where that implies

• decent intonation that's easy to steer

• a flexible lively sound that can be brassy or mellow, but always clear

• not too big, and comfortable to hold and play

• maybe rotary valves... fast and quiet, anyway

• not necessarily Miraphone, even though I used 188 as an example

• pretty good odds that a tuba of that model will be a good one

Firebird or bel canto

LeMark wrote: ↑Sun May 01, 2022 7:13 pm Firebird or bel canto

Well, that seems pretty decisive. Nice!

Sounds like you are describing an Alexander F tuba

B&S PT-10

I freak jury questions.

I’d agree with the Firebird. Never played one I didn’t like, and just so consistent.

I wonder where the 3099/2 (non “W”) would rank if B&S would actually produce and promote them?

Bloke's F tuba

jtm wrote: ↑Sun May 01, 2022 7:11 pm What's like the F tuba equivalent of a Miraphone 188 or 186, where that implies

• decent intonation that's easy to steer

• a flexible lively sound that can be brassy or mellow, but always clear

• not too big, and comfortable to hold and play

• maybe rotary valves... fast and quiet, anyway

• not necessarily Miraphone, even though I used 188 as an example

• pretty good odds that a tuba of that model will be a good one

A Besson 982 Eb tuba?

YFB621 not rotary but checks every other box. Hopefully, the new piston f tuba from Eastman

Casca Grossa wrote: ↑Mon May 02, 2022 12:06 pm Bloke's F tuba

I suppose out of laziness, I quit looking at new models a couple of years ago. I’ve never found one that measured up.
I actually bought one of the Gronitz piston models a long time ago - and for a fairly high price (for a bottom feeder like me), simply to try it, because they were never at tuba shindigs. It immediately disappointed me, but I managed to sell it a couple of weeks later for $1000 more, because it was “the latest thing”, and because it looked shiny-new.

Yes, but do any of the above-mentioned suggestions have "The Dent"?

Even – after a while – Dumbo realized that he didn’t need his feather.

For me, it's the B&S F tuba with the fully 16-21mm graduated bore, currently the Model 3100, but known in the past as the "Symphonie".

https://www.b-and-s.com/en/instruments/f-tubas/3100-2/

Like the 188, the current version is not sprinkled with the same fairy dust as the earlier versions, and for the same reason: The early versions were far more hand-made than the current versions.

Also like the 188, it's a little smaller than current orchestra professionals (and those who wish to emulate them) presently prefer. But, again like the 188, it's larger than it looks, and didn't seem to be a problem for notable past performers. And both were considered "large" compared to "regular" instruments when they were first offered.

More similar attributes: Easy intonation tendencies, a clear voice in a large ensemble, plenty loud even for big works, and quirks that are much easier to manage than those who don't play them realize. And though both are offered in their catalogs, one does not see them very often at shows (at least back when we had shows), or in stock at stores.

Since the early 80's, B&S has increased the bore of their "standard" F tubas, seemingly to make them a bit more contrabass-like. In my view, it makes them a little more hollow-sounding and doesn't really relieve their quirks fully enough to be worth losing that sweet quality.

Rick "can't blow the low C like a contrabass, and the effect of the 'dent' is not transferrable" Denney

If I need for my F tuba to sound "piston-F-tuba-bland", I have a mouthpiece that will do that...and - yet (unlike so many of the piston F tubas) - the instrument can still easily be played in tune.

I haven't played many, but the best was a Firebird and the worst was an SLP.

The only F tuba that I owned was the Yamaha YFB 822. The sound was huge, the response was even through all registers and the intonation was very good. Being a long-time Eb tuba player, I was looking for a tuba in F that sounded and responded like an Eb tuba. The YFB 822 was it. However, when I finally designed and assembled what turned out to be my dream Eb tuba, I sold the F tuba and went back to what I knew best.

I've tried many F tubas, owned several, but the Firebird is clearly the 188 of F tubas. Great response, great intonation, facile, flexible, fun.

In former times, we would say "186!" But you could say, "Firebird!" and the meaning is close to the same, at least among F tubas.

I haven't played one in years but probably the Firebird. I seem to recall it being an easier play than the PT tubas. I did have a Miraphone 1281 the last year or two in the Army. I played a bunch of bass tubas wherever I could and ended up with that. Before I got the 1281 I played what I think was a 187 Bb (no model number that I recall, bigger than an 186).

fwiw-
MW2141- wonderful horn, little dark, plays great, really bad valve angle for me (6'10", 37" sleeves)
Kanstul small F- like a 621F with a slightly different (they're still all tubas) tone, Kanstul liked their front valves to look like top valves
Kanstul Eb- big, fat Eb sound, meh low register, Kanstul valves (see above)
St. Petersburg rotary Eb- great playing horn! Very constant blow throughout the range, played like a piston horn, didn't think my unit would buy a budget horn, I'd buy one now, very colorful sound but I think my Slavic roots are showing
Cerveny 653F- another slick horn, but definitely a small bass tuba, I'd also buy one now, think they're discontinued
Miraphone Star and Star Light- stiff, didn't do anything for me; another guy had one and couldn't play Eb for anything
PT F tubas- see above

I played the 1281 everywhere- strolling jazz, sit-down loud and low funk tunes, concert band and quintet. It played well and had a great low C but I could never get the color I wanted. The low range also fell off some below low C; I got the impression it was built to impress on that 'low C on an F tuba'- thing and not much more below that. YMMV

/ramble