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known, yet-under-known and under-rated players
Posted: Sun Feb 04, 2024 10:42 am
by bloke
There are some really great players who really don't draw attention to themselves.
I would place them in three categories - [1] full-time players, [2] part-time players (who might BOTH play for remuneration AND for pleasure), and [3] those who only play for the pleasure of playing.
I see NO reason to RANK such "under-the-radar/don't particularly promote themselves players, but here are a couple that I will use to begin the thread:
full-time player: ie. [1]
-
Jeff Anderson - San Francisco Symphony
He's extremely unassuming (I might even say: "modest"), and could walk through just about ANY "elephant room" unnoticed/unknown...
WHAT...A...PLAYER !!! 
part-time player: ie. [2]
-
Bill Holt - south Texas
Bill puts in ridiculous hours in law enforcement/security, YET finds time to keep up his playing. Like me, he owns/uses both lengths of bass tubas and both lengths of contrabass tubas. Ensemble-playing-wise, has a remarkable understanding of style(s), and (just as important) a very good ear for tuning and resonance.
Re: known, yet-under-known and under-rated players
Posted: Sun Feb 04, 2024 10:52 am
by LeMark
Kent Eshelman. Teaches at Baylor, monster player, but nobody ever talks about him because he isn't into self promotion
Re: known, yet-under-known and under-rated players
Posted: Sun Feb 04, 2024 10:52 am
by arpthark
Art Hovey, wonderful jazz player, formerly of the New Haven Symphony (per-service pro orchestra), don't think he's made it to this board yet. We have all probably heard of Art but he's fantastic.
Re: known, yet-under-known and under-rated players
Posted: Sun Feb 04, 2024 10:58 am
by BRS
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Re: known, yet-under-known and under-rated players
Posted: Sun Feb 04, 2024 11:01 am
by BRS
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Re: known, yet-under-known and under-rated players
Posted: Sun Feb 04, 2024 11:07 am
by bloke
BRS wrote: ↑Sun Feb 04, 2024 10:58 am
LeMark wrote: ↑Sun Feb 04, 2024 10:52 am
Kent Eshelman. Teaches at Baylor, monster player, but nobody ever talks about him because he isn't into self promotion
Neat factoid about Kent: He’s from a family of tuba players. His dad and sister both play tuba!
I helped Kent out (a few years ago) cleaning up the inside of one of his instruments - prior to him putting down some tracks.
He also wanted some synthetic piston washes - the advantage of which are "plenty quiet enough, and last a very long time".
I sold him a set, BUT fitted that tuba with new genuine felt washers (which I convinced him to use for the recording session).
His Dad sold me the (rare) late-50's 3+1 compensating detachable recording bell Besson E-flat (which - I'm thinking - belonged to some band with which he played...Shriners...?? something else...??)
Don't discount the daughter/sister...a fine player.
Re: known, yet-under-known and under-rated players
Posted: Mon Feb 05, 2024 12:10 am
by tofu
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Re: known, yet-under-known and under-rated players
Posted: Mon Feb 05, 2024 9:47 am
by bort2.0
My default addition to this list -- Kevin Ladd.
Went to Juilliard, gigged/subbed in NYC, then landed the orchestra job in Syracuse, NY (I believe in the early 1970s, at the beginning of the downturn for that city, and it's loss of ~1/3 of its population).
After the orchestra folded in Syracuse, he moved to Baltimore and played in the Baltimore Opera (which folded soon afterwards itself!) and became a public school music teacher (and gigged/subbed in Baltimore too... but that's a much smaller scale of opportunities there). I had the great privilege of playing alongside Kevin in a yearly (bi-yearly? I forget...) band composed of music educators in the county, plus a few other hand-picked backfill players (that was me!).
Heck of a nice guy
Very humble
The ability to play very, very softly with a clear and controlled tone
And the ability to play loud and big stuff to knock down walls
Used his Marzan 4-valve CC tuba his entire career/same mouthpiece forever (Schilke 67, IIRC)
Micro-adjusting with the top-facing tuning slide constantly and never playing a single wrong note, or out of tune
Haven't chatted with him in well over 10 years...
... hope he is doing well!
Re: known, yet-under-known and under-rated players
Posted: Mon Feb 05, 2024 10:32 am
by MikeS
bort2.0 wrote: ↑Mon Feb 05, 2024 9:47 am
My default addition to this list -- Kevin Ladd.
In addition to everything said above, I’ll add, gifted teacher, great sense of humor, and one of the best folk around to share a few beers and conversation with. When he was in Syracuse, in addition to the Marzan, he had a six valve Alexander F tuba. He could make it sing but it was virtually unplayable by anyone else. He appears to still be active.
https://www.endlessmountain.net/orchestra-roster
Just don’t ask him to remodel your kitchen…
Re: known, yet-under-known and under-rated players
Posted: Mon Feb 05, 2024 12:09 pm
by internalanarchy
There are a lot of orchestral players that are probably just as good as the "big 5" guys but aren't as well known. Steve Campbell (Minnesota), Craig Knox (Pittsburgh), Randy Montgomery (Milwaukee) are three that come to mind.
Re: known, yet-under-known and under-rated players
Posted: Mon Feb 05, 2024 1:02 pm
by bisontuba
I believe the tuba player in Milwaukee is Robyn Black...
Re: known, yet-under-known and under-rated players
Posted: Mon Feb 05, 2024 1:13 pm
by bort2.0
MikeS wrote: ↑Mon Feb 05, 2024 10:32 am
bort2.0 wrote: ↑Mon Feb 05, 2024 9:47 am
My default addition to this list -- Kevin Ladd.
In addition to everything said above, I’ll add, gifted teacher, great sense of humor, and one of the best folk around to share a few beers and conversation with. When he was in Syracuse, in addition to the Marzan, he had a six valve Alexander F tuba. He could make it sing but it was virtually unplayable by anyone else. He appears to still be active.
https://www.endlessmountain.net/orchestra-roster
Just don’t ask him to remodel your kitchen…
Good to hear that!
IIRC, he sold the Alex F through BBC a few years ago.
IIRC #2, I think he told me his parents bought him that Alexander F and it was a huge deal (must've been the 1960s or so?). I think that was part of the "I'm going to learn to play this and use it because I have it", which leads to "I've played it a lot, and I've mastered THIS instrument" which leads to us saying "wow he sounds great on that."
Re: known, yet-under-known and under-rated players
Posted: Mon Feb 05, 2024 1:18 pm
by bloke
I suspect some R.O.P.A and per-service people (who aren't interested in moving - thus not interested in auditioning) may well be top-tier players as well...and maybe (also) not interested in drawing attention to themselves online.
Re: known, yet-under-known and under-rated players
Posted: Mon Feb 05, 2024 1:45 pm
by Casca Grossa
bort2.0 wrote: ↑Mon Feb 05, 2024 9:47 am
My default addition to this list -- Kevin Ladd.
Went to Juilliard, gigged/subbed in NYC, then landed the orchestra job in Syracuse, NY (I believe in the early 1970s, at the beginning of the downturn for that city, and it's loss of ~1/3 of its population).
After the orchestra folded in Syracuse, he moved to Baltimore and played in the Baltimore Opera (which folded soon afterwards itself!) and became a public school music teacher (and gigged/subbed in Baltimore too... but that's a much smaller scale of opportunities there). I had the great privilege of playing alongside Kevin in a yearly (bi-yearly? I forget...) band composed of music educators in the county, plus a few other hand-picked backfill players (that was me!).
Heck of a nice guy
Very humble
The ability to play very, very softly with a clear and controlled tone
And the ability to play loud and big stuff to knock down walls
Used his Marzan 4-valve CC tuba his entire career/same mouthpiece forever (Schilke 67, IIRC)
Micro-adjusting with the top-facing tuning slide constantly and never playing a single wrong note, or out of tune
Haven't chatted with him in well over 10 years...
... hope he is doing well!
I worked with Kevin Ladd at a music camp about 30 years ago for one summer. What a fantastic player and a great guy. The camp had a policy of no practice before 6 am. Kevin used to get up for a morning walk and then hit the practice room. My alarm was him starting to practice at 6 am on the dot across the trail from the cabin I stayed in.
Re: known, yet-under-known and under-rated players
Posted: Mon Feb 05, 2024 1:49 pm
by bloke
sidebar:
I remember a really fine (camper) trumpet player, back when Interlochen hosted the University of Michigan School of Music summer session.
He was also an early riser, and would begin practicing really early, but he would take afternoon naps (between whatever and whatever).
His roommate was another very fine college-age trumpet player.
The napper's roommate referred to the napper as (never calling him by his name) as "sack-man".
Re: known, yet-under-known and under-rated players
Posted: Mon Feb 05, 2024 3:06 pm
by MikeS
bloke wrote: ↑Mon Feb 05, 2024 1:18 pm
I suspect some R.O.P.A and per-service people (who aren't interested in moving - thus not interested in auditioning) may well be top-tier players as well...and maybe (also) not interested in drawing attention to themselves online.
Three chairs to Kevin Ladd’s right in the Syracuse Symphony sat principal trombone Bill Harris. For the time I lived in that neck of the woods I was always in awe of the music that came out of that man’s horn. I would have payed good money to hear him play scales, and think he likely could have played anywhere he wanted. He has deep roots in the community there, plenty of family around, loves the area, and always made a decent living from playing and teaching.
Re: known, yet-under-known and under-rated players
Posted: Mon Feb 05, 2024 7:52 pm
by bort2.0
When I played in that teacher band with Kevin, the first horn player was a retired guy from some orchestra job... Holy crap, he was amazing, I had never heard a horn played like that in-person or in a group that I was playing in.... And I was probably 25 years old or so. Older guy, would ride his motorcycle to rehearsals with his horn on his back.
Sadly, he died in a motorcycle accident a few years later. I'll have to look it up and remember who he was.
Re: known, yet-under-known and under-rated players
Posted: Wed Feb 07, 2024 5:43 pm
by dsfinley
Vurl Bland out of Texas is a phenomenal player. I loved my time studying with him. Genuinely great human being.
Re: known, yet-under-known and under-rated players
Posted: Thu Feb 08, 2024 5:17 am
by Doc
bloke wrote: ↑Sun Feb 04, 2024 10:42 am
There are some really great players who really don't draw attention to themselves.
I would place them in three categories - [1] full-time players, [2] part-time players (who might BOTH play for remuneration AND for pleasure), and [3] those who only play for the pleasure of playing.
I see NO reason to RANK such "under-the-radar/don't particularly promote themselves players, but here are a couple that I will use to begin the thread:
full-time player: ie. [1]
-
Jeff Anderson - San Francisco Symphony
He's extremely unassuming (I might even say: "modest"), and could walk through just about ANY "elephant room" unnoticed/unknown ...
WHAT...A...PLAYER !!!
part-time player: ie. [2]
-
Bill Holt - south Texas
Bill puts in ridiculous hours in law enforcement/security, YET finds time to keep up his playing. Like me, he owns/uses both lengths of bass tubas and both lengths of contrabass tubas. Ensemble-playing-wise, has a remarkable understanding of style(s), and (just as important) a very good ear for tuning and resonance.
Re: known, yet-under-known and under-rated players
Posted: Thu Feb 08, 2024 3:56 pm
by scottw
BRS wrote: ↑Sun Feb 04, 2024 10:58 am
LeMark wrote: ↑Sun Feb 04, 2024 10:52 am
Kent Eshelman. Teaches at Baylor, monster player, but nobody ever talks about him because he isn't into self promotion
Neat factoid about Kent: He’s from a family of tuba players. His dad and sister both play tuba!
One of the most unusual and skillful things I ever heard was Eshelman at a TUSAB several years ago: At the Thursday night concert, he played a wonderful tuba solo right handed, as well as accompanying himself lefthanded on piano--still can't figure how he was able to do that.