Every once in a while, it's just nice to do some maintenance stuff to my OWN instrument (even though $0.00)
Posted: Tue Feb 13, 2024 5:50 pm
by bloke
OK...
Let's just say (ref: weird comments from another thread, as I don't understand the significance) I took in my 42-year-old F tuba for "warranty" work...N/C (Thanks, self. )
I knocked out a few chips/small dents, minor bell issues (from using BAGS), I used a couple of tricks to smooth out BOTH the upper bow AND it's nickel cap WITHOUT removing the bottom bow, I replaced (not all, but) a few of the rotor bumpers which were slightly noisy and slightly beat down (it's been at least a decade), and I did my econo/effective HOT water flush (which - as evidence suggested - was overdue).
It plays...so...damn...well after cleaning it out.
btw...
I'd like to settle this bullsh!t "small German rotary low C" crap once and for all.
- This tuba's mouthpipe begins at-or-under .500" (c. 12.7mm).
- The first encountered circuit's bore is a mere 17mm (.669")
- Not until the "2nd valve" (4th circuit) does the bore finally reach the (way overused, in the tuba-building industry) 19mm bore size.
- Although I know how to prevent valve wear (and do prevent it), these rotors have been used heavily (by me) for 42 years.
OK...Here's your ___-____ "tenuous low C"...which discounts serious consideration of "German" (and, in particular, older "small" ones) F tubas:
...but bloke, you're a " 'feshunul"
I'm a 67-year-old man who barely practices (intend to, but am too tired, at the end of most days), and haven't played THIS particular instrument for SEVERAL months (yet, I REALLY need to use it, this-coming month).
annual income from playin' the toobuh...?? "pfft"
...so I ain't nuthin'...other than a tuba-blower...with a non-groupthink-approved old funky/"small" F tuba.
WHY I was motivated to - albeit way overdue - clean out this instrument?
I not only am expected to play this mess in less than a month, ...and there are NINE pages of this mess. Further, there's a SECOND tuba part, the guy I recommended they hire to play that part ACTUALLY practices and plays a HELLUVA lot better 'n' me, so I'd prefer to only be shown up "some", rather than totally humiliated.
Re: Every once in a while, it's just nice to do some maintenance stuff to my OWN instrument (even though $0.00)
Posted: Wed Feb 14, 2024 10:30 am
by PlayTheTuba
bloke wrote: ↑Tue Feb 13, 2024 5:50 pm
(way overused, in the tuba-building industry) 19mm bore size.
I agree with you wholeheartedly, but that bore size for that particular model could also be the reason why that horn is so special.
Plus, I am sure at certain point the 0.687 inch (17.45 mm) or 0.689 (17.501 mm) was all the rage in the tuba world too
Oh and maybe, mmmaaayyybbe, the lack of lacquer (due to time and peeled off over time) allows the tuba to resonate more too
bloke wrote: ↑Tue Feb 13, 2024 5:50 pm
but bloke, you're a " 'feshunul"
I thought you (and your colleagues) discussed how you went back to "amateur? "
Re: Every once in a while, it's just nice to do some maintenance stuff to my OWN instrument (even though $0.00)
Posted: Wed Feb 14, 2024 11:05 am
by b.williams
Looks like a euphonium part.
Re: Every once in a while, it's just nice to do some maintenance stuff to my OWN instrument (even though $0.00)
Posted: Wed Feb 14, 2024 11:10 am
by bloke
Only one of the circuits on this instrument (semitone - #2) features a 19mm bore.
this instrument's bore sizes are (by mm's)
(12.7 to 17 - mouthpipe) 17-18-18-19-20-21
large size of main slide: 24
Re: Every once in a while, it's just nice to do some maintenance stuff to my OWN instrument (even though $0.00)
Posted: Wed Feb 14, 2024 11:11 am
by bloke
b.williams wrote: ↑Wed Feb 14, 2024 11:05 am
Looks like a euphonium part.
I believe the more difficult part is the 2nd tuba (contrabass) part, whereby they are required to race around - in a similar manner, but - in the contrabass range.
Re: Every once in a while, it's just nice to do some maintenance stuff to my OWN instrument (even though $0.00)
Posted: Wed Feb 14, 2024 11:23 am
by arpthark
Did your orchestra provide that engraved copy or did you or someone you know do it?
I remember when I found that full score of the Tippett it was all handwritten and pretty hard to read. I assumed the parts were also handwritten.
Pretty interesting piece, and I do not envy your job of stringing all that together coherently!
Re: Every once in a while, it's just nice to do some maintenance stuff to my OWN instrument (even though $0.00)
b.williams wrote: ↑Wed Feb 14, 2024 11:05 am
Looks like a euphonium part.
I believe the more difficult part is the 2nd tuba (contrabass) part, whereby they are required to race around - in a similar manner, but - in the contrabass range.
(With regard to playing the part) Does all that effort pay musical dividends? Are the results worth the effort?
Re: Every once in a while, it's just nice to do some maintenance stuff to my OWN instrument (even though $0.00)
b.williams wrote: ↑Wed Feb 14, 2024 11:05 am
Looks like a euphonium part.
I believe the more difficult part is the 2nd tuba (contrabass) part, whereby they are required to race around - in a similar manner, but - in the contrabass range.
(With regard to playing the part) Does all that effort pay musical dividends? Are the results worth the effort?
I do not know whether Gene or Jake recorded this, and I certainly don't know who was brought in to play second. If you like, I can email Gene and ask. I could also send you the score, if you would agree to delete it after reviewing the recording.
EDIT: okay...
My own question got my own curiosity up. I just asked him.
My understanding of the piece that it is sort of one of those birth-life-death pieces, as is the trumpet concerto written for Ryan Anthony.
Re: Every once in a while, it's just nice to do some maintenance stuff to my OWN instrument (even though $0.00)
Posted: Wed Feb 14, 2024 12:40 pm
by bloke
Gene doesn't remember it, so probably Jake or/and Martin.
Re: Every once in a while, it's just nice to do some maintenance stuff to my OWN instrument (even though $0.00)
I believe the more difficult part is the 2nd tuba (contrabass) part, whereby they are required to race around - in a similar manner, but - in the contrabass range.
(With regard to playing the part) Does all that effort pay musical dividends? Are the results worth the effort?
I do not know whether Gene or Jake recorded this, and I certainly don't know who was brought in to play second. If you like, I can email Gene and ask. I could also send you the score, if you would agree to delete it after reviewing the recording.
EDIT: okay...
My own question got my own curiosity up. I just asked him.
My understanding of the piece that it is sort of one of those birth-life-death pieces, as is the trumpet concerto written for Ryan Anthony.
Thank you for the offer. Sending the score won't be necessary. I just listened the the 4th Symphony using the link you provided. It is indeed very challenging. For me, the effort required to play the part would not be worth it. It would be a very different if I could play the part without much prep. Also, hard to listen to, so much happening.
Re: Every once in a while, it's just nice to do some maintenance stuff to my OWN instrument (even though $0.00)
Posted: Wed Feb 14, 2024 1:44 pm
by bloke
@b.williams
yes...
All of us (at least those of us in "The Hang®" - ie. low brass) have remarked on how very much is happening...and it's chaotic - just as is life.
Almost never - in life - are we only presented with a single stimuli, yes?
The most common of the three primary tempi ♩ = 60, is supposed to be conducted at ♪ = 120, which should help sort things out somewhat. Even the opening tempo - ♩ = 50 - is listed as ♪ = 100. I believe the composer understood that - without such specific direction - there was little chance of all the bits-and-pieces lining up as written.
again: I insisted on bringing in a remarkably fine tuba player, Todd French, to play 2nd tuba...so (when I get lost) I feel confident that he'll show me where I went wrong, and get me back on track. That having been said, I'm playing all of the passages (by now) well enough to now
- begin listening to the recording while following the score, and
- once I feel comfortable following the score -
- I'm going to pull my 1970's two-column (tremendously powerful) P.A. over this way, and see about playing along with the recording a bunch of times.
I'm sure I'll end up getting lost-and-found (the first few times, without a conductor), but - once I can play along with the recording (with NO conductor), maybe (??) I'll be able to play it WITH one, and not embarrass myself too much in front of Dr. French.
As far as playing these passages is concerned (and I'm sure that people always interpret this as some sort of "modesty", but...) my F tuba is (as it always does) playing them for me.
To be frank, that photographed page - at tempo - is sounding quite clear...but - without this tuba (which - again - plays things FOR me, and yes: really) I tend to wonder if I could negotiate these passages particularly well (ref my adage/truism: "Most tubas suck.")
Re: Every once in a while, it's just nice to do some maintenance stuff to my OWN instrument (even though $0.00)
Posted: Wed Feb 14, 2024 2:46 pm
by b.williams
bloke wrote: ↑Wed Feb 14, 2024 1:44 pm
@b.williams
yes...
All of us (at least those of us in "The Hang®" - ie. low brass) have remarked on how very much is happening...and it's chaotic - just as is life.
Almost never - in life - are we only presented with a single stimuli, yes?
The most common of the three primary tempi ♩ = 60, is supposed to be conducted at ♪ = 120, which should help sort things out somewhat. Even the opening tempo - ♩ = 50 - is listed as ♪ = 100. I believe the composer understood that - without such specific direction - there was little chance of all the bits-and-pieces lining up as written.
again: I insisted on bringing in a remarkably fine tuba player, Todd French, to play 2nd tuba...so (when I get lost) I feel confident that he'll show me where I went wrong, and get me back on track. That having been said, I'm playing all of the passages (by now) well enough to now
- begin listening to the recording while following the score, and
- once I feel comfortable following the score -
- I'm going to pull my 1970's two-column (tremendously powerful) P.A. over this way, and see about playing along with the recording a bunch of times.
I'm sure I'll end up getting lost-and-found (the first few times, without a conductor), but - once I can play along with the recording (with NO conductor), maybe (??) I'll be able to play it WITH one, and not embarrass myself too much in front of Dr. French.
As far as playing these passages is concerned (and I'm sure that people always interpret this as some sort of "modesty", but...) my F tuba is (as it always does) playing them for me.
To be frank, that photographed page - at tempo - is sounding quite clear...but - without this tuba (which - again - plays things FOR me, and yes: really) I tend to wonder if I could negotiate these passages particularly well (ref my adage/truism: "Most tubas suck.")
The above plan is solid. Keep us updated on how it works out.
Re: Every once in a while, it's just nice to do some maintenance stuff to my OWN instrument (even though $0.00)
Posted: Wed Feb 14, 2024 2:57 pm
by Tubajug
I think I've mentioned this before, but Todd French was my first (and only, outside of my college professor) private teacher. He was here in Nebraska getting his masters, I believe. Great guy!
Re: Every once in a while, it's just nice to do some maintenance stuff to my OWN instrument (even though $0.00)
Posted: Wed Feb 14, 2024 5:03 pm
by PlayTheTuba
bloke wrote: ↑Wed Feb 14, 2024 11:10 am
Only one of the circuits on this instrument (semitone - #2) features a 19mm bore.
this instrument's bore sizes are (by mm's)
(12.7 to 17 - mouthpipe) 17-18-18-19-20-21
large size of main slide: 24
True, I also wonder if more instruments would benefit having gradual size increases with in-line (no big gaps in-between) valves. But that's for manufacturers and franken-tuba assemblers job to figure out.
Re: Every once in a while, it's just nice to do some maintenance stuff to my OWN instrument (even though $0.00)
I do not know whether Gene or Jake recorded this, and I certainly don't know who was brought in to play second. If you like, I can email Gene and ask. I could also send you the score, if you would agree to delete it after reviewing the recording.
The discography in the back of Song of Wind says Tim Meyers was on euphonium, no mention of another tubist besides AJ
Re: Every once in a while, it's just nice to do some maintenance stuff to my OWN instrument (even though $0.00)
Posted: Wed Feb 14, 2024 6:39 pm
by bloke
arpthark wrote: ↑Wed Feb 14, 2024 11:23 am
Did your orchestra provide that engraved copy or did you or someone you know do it?
I remember when I found that full score of the Tippett it was all handwritten and pretty hard to read. I assumed the parts were also handwritten.
Pretty interesting piece, and I do not envy your job of stringing all that together coherently!
The conductor's score - to this day - is still in the manuscript that you saw/found.
Via undisclosed sources, I had access to (original manuscript versions) of tuba parts 1 and 2.
When these parts became available (musicians website) I was surprised to see that the parts had been engraved...
...I can't imagine that this piece is performed particularly often (thus being surprised that it had been engraved)...
...and for the same reason that hardly anyone has played Tchaikovsky's (full orchestra, and 45 minutes long - which would otherwise define something that - yes? - should be as popular as his "symphonies" 4, 5, & 6) - his Suite #3...
Both pieces (the seldom-played and semi-obscure Tchaik Suite #3 and this Tippett Symphony #4) are (well...) hard.
Here's a video of the Suite #3 with the scores pages moving along with the music:
Re: Every once in a while, it's just nice to do some maintenance stuff to my OWN instrument (even though $0.00)
Posted: Wed Feb 14, 2024 6:46 pm
by bloke
jtuba wrote:The discography in the back of Song of Wind says Tim Meyers was on euphonium, no mention of another tubist besides AJ
...so Myers (SLSO ?)
hmm...
I suppose euphonium makes a lot of sense...being an English piece.
I wonder if my music director would be disappointed were I to play Tuba 1 on a euphonium.
He already told me that he wants the loud passages to be LOUD...I can't make quite as much racket with a euphonium (vs. an F tuba).
Re: Every once in a while, it's just nice to do some maintenance stuff to my OWN instrument (even though $0.00)
Posted: Wed Feb 14, 2024 10:01 pm
by bloke
I just played through all the big passages on euphonium. They are pretty easy, but not particularly exciting.
)
