me 'n' Matt Good...

[bloke]

He and I are long-distance buddies.
We probably don't vote the same, but are fond of each other, and share interests (pets, sense of humor, etc.) other than the tuba. We also send each other messages - occasionally chuckling at what someone paid for this-or-that on eBay, etc.)

He picked up on my quickie/hillbilly tuba cleaning method, and has posted pictures of himself using my method (via his social media page) standing out on his driveway - just past his garage...probably access to his water tank from there.

It requires a REAL RUBBER garden hose (as heat will cause any vinyl hose to come apart at the ends...and - not only will the hose be screwed up, but - a person could also end up getting scalded.

...so I remove the main slide, and jet HOT water through the instrument while (enthusiastically) wiggling the valves...and not just for a few seconds...probably for at least a minute.

Most (probably not 100%...) of the green slime gets knocked loose and ends up (either) on the ground (or - the way I'm doing it) going down the utility tub's drain.

me...??

I use a salvaged washing machine connector hose. Both ends of these are female, but available for sale is a double-male-hose-threads thingie, which converts those into short/high-compression/"regular" hoses. I fasten an (all brass/old-fashioned hose nozzle and "jet" the hot water into the mouthpipe and out the main slide (small size) tube. (again: the main slide is removed, so as to not fill up the tuba - past the valve section - with water.



This isn't any sort of "perfect" cleaning job, but it knocks a large percentage (most of...?? a bunch of...??) the slime out and without removing anything from the instrument other than the main slide. I know for a fact that those disgusting "slime tabs" (which form in the porting next to casings, as well as the porting within pistons and rotors) can actually LIFT (when blowing air through the instrument) and (yep) can contribute to (or CAUSE) missed attacks.

Mrs. bloke helps me hold my tuba upright in the faucet-outfitted utility tub (bottom bow on a towel) while doing this, but I'm considering running a hot water faucet to the outside of the shop (some people are having these included on new house construction, these days), so I can just rest the tuba outdoors in the grass (ok: maybe on a towel in the grass), and won't have to be so careful (having to avoid indoor obstacles).

[bloke]

something else:

If some of you try this and (particularly) if your rotors are sticking and they weren't before, just try doing it again. You probably knocked some slimy gook loose that's now sandwiched between one or more of the rotors and their casings, and a second run of this would probably knock the rest of that stuff out (which was almost blown out the first time).

Obviously, pistons can be removed more easily and brushes can be run through their porting and through the casings. This method (hot water flush) is particularly advantageous for rotary instruments, because they require more time and care in (complete) disassembly and reassembly (avoided with this short-cut method) to clean them the so-called real (and more thorough) way.

Also, when people ask me what type of soap or detergent I use to clean out my tubas, the answer is that I don't. If there isn't any hard lime coating the interior, a brush and hot water - or just hot water alone at a high velocity (this thread's outlined short-cut better-than-nothing method) - works, and - if there's hard lime - no (alkaline) soap or detergent going to touch it. It's going to need to be soaked in something acid-based.

When school instruments come in, I'm not able to use this method that I use on my own instruments, because they nearly always have not been cleaned "since forever" (with most of them never being either oiled or greased), the valves and slides all feel "sandy", and most are heavily coated on the inside with hard lime. They all need the real thing, and to be soaked in an acid solution for a few minutes after being completely disassembled.

If you've read a bunch of my stuff that I post, the reason that I believe I'm able to get away with this high velocity water method is because I heavily oil my instruments' valve section interiors prior to every time I play them. Again, I use oil of negligible cost (lamp oil for valve body surfaces and mineral oil for small mechanical surfaces) so I can easily afford to do this. The fact that much of Interiors of the valve sections of my instruments are oily while I'm playing them really discourages hard lime buildup.

[MikeS]

For those who enjoy spending money more than @bloke does, these work pretty well. Its one (possible) advantage is that you can send it further up different sections of tubing on the horn.

https://www.dillonmusic.com/hydeo-jet.html?id=24784850

[bloke]

The link seems to be going sideways for me. Assuming there's a description to go with it that I'm not able to access from here, does the description claim anything about not coming apart when hot water is run through it? The blue color hints (okay, but not necessarily) at a non-rubber type of material (to me), and - as I've said before - vinyl hoses (in my experience) tend to come apart when water in the 125° to 135° range is run through them.

... so if it's vinyl, I would suppose there's a trade off between targeting specific areas and the advantage of hotter water breaking things loose more effectively...(??)

The brass nozzle adjusted to a "jet" - in my experience - also offer some benefit in regards to velocity.

[MiBrassFS]

I have something like this that attaches to a hose and can plug into leadpipes. Works pretty well for a quick flush out. I image bloke’s nozzle is something similar.

https://www.thomannmusic.com/stoelzel_i ... 590427.htm

Clipboard Dec 22, 2024 at 9.45 AM.jpeg

[bloke]

I have something like this that attaches to a hose and can plug into leadpipes. Works pretty well for a quick flush out. I image bloke’s nozzle is something similar.

https://www.thomannmusic.com/stoelzel_i ... 590427.htm


Clipboard Dec 22, 2024 at 9.45 AM.jpeg

I just hold the hose nozzle flush with the receiver. Yeah it can get messy, but I just try to be steady. I've seen those small nozzles that are not adjustable and have thought about picking one of them up, because I can see that they could be ground down to fit inside a receiver.

One characteristic that I tend to have - that might be a flaw - is that I tend to not buy things until I've thought about buying them for tremendously long period of time...

... but >> changing the subject <<, there are a whole bunch of repair tools that a whole bunch of people seem to own which I would never buy, because when I think about the methodology involved, I've worked out my own ways to do those same jobs which are simpler / more directly connected to my own hands, and surely significantly quicker and maybe even safer.

Now, you are actually making me wonder about simply grinding the flare off of the exterior of my run of the mill brass hose nozzle, to see if that might allow it to insert into receivers. (I've never claimed that I'm not lazy.)

[MiBrassFS]

Ha! I think about purchases a long time, too. My biggest problem right now is that I’ve made a lifetime of purchases after thinking about them, but I’m not good at getting rid of stuff! I’ve mostly resorted to giving stuff away…

I’m really good at buying tools!

I bought this nozzle used from another tuba player clearing out stuff. It’s one of those little expenditures that I’m glad I made every time I use it. I lay the instrument in a tub and just let the water run for a while with the valves depressed to get all the circuits.

[bloke]

The rapid wiggling of the rotors and the really high velocity hot water - I suspect - seems to be beneficial, because - over and over - I'm suddenly changing which edges of which disgusting little snot pedals seem to get caught with the jet of water, and I believe that helps knock them loose.

Those things really can lift and flap around while we are blowing through our instruments, and I really believe they can cause us to miss notes or articulate them badly. I'm also convinced that sometimes we mistake those gross little snot flaps flapping around for water being stuck in our horn somewhere that we cannot find.

[MikeS]

The link seems to be going sideways for me. Assuming there's a description to go with it that I'm not able to access from here, does the description claim anything about not coming apart when hot water is run through it? The blue color hints (okay, but not necessarily) at a non-rubber type of material (to me), and - as I've said before - vinyl hoses (in my experience) tend to come apart when water in the 125° to 135° range is run through them.

... so if it's vinyl, I would suppose there's a trade off between targeting specific areas and the advantage of hotter water breaking things loose more effectively...(??)

The brass nozzle adjusted to a "jet" - in my experience - also offer some benefit in regards to velocity.

Maybe this link will work better for you.

https://www.jm-gmbh.de/en/hydro-jet-m1/

The hose seems to be made of some kind of plastic. It is a bit less flexible than I imagine rubber would be. I run full-on hot water through mine with no issues, at least so far.

[bloke]

I like it.
Now, the only issue that I would wonder about is whether the dispersal (in various directions - vs. one direction) contributes to loosening the disgusting snot pedals or reduces the ability for the water (being that it's energy is pointed in diverse directions) do that.

[MiBrassFS]

I *think* the hydro jet hose shoots water out sideways which may have a similar effect to the valve wiggling…

[BramJ]

I have the hydro jet aswell, no problem with hot water
There are 4 holes (or more? Hmm, I need to use it more often) that jet out the water at an outward angle.

Be sure to hold it securely, if it slides out you get wet very fast

[gocsick]

Another +1 for the hydrojet! I play a lot of beer drinking gigs so I clean the side Sousas frequently. I was having trouble with gunk when I was just doing brushes in the valve casing and washing the valves so to gunk buildup in the leadpipe and knuckles. Hot water and the Hydrojet blasts it out. Pull valves and slides. Takes two minutes to run down the leadpipe and the valve circuits. Never any sluggish valve issues anymore.

[

[bloke]

I'm tempted to buy one, but I'm afraid I would use it just about as often as I use the cable camera I bought when everyone was buying those things.. which is like never.

[Matt Good]

I use this hose end nozzle with a 1/4 turn valve:

https://imgur.com/WLsAAmr

Using an adjustable wrench to make a tight fit, I attach a rubber hot water rated water hose on the hot output valve to on a wall mounted tankless water heater on the exterior of my home. There are two valves on a tankless water heater, one cold and the other is hot. The hot water valve is usually on the left side. I turn down my setting on the water heater to 120 degrees (Idk if the temperature is exactly 120 but we usually have it set to 135 to more effectively clean dishes in the dishwasher. 135 degrees is a little too excessive) I then attach the nozzle to the hose and run it so that the hose is filled with hot water.

While I holding the instrument upright, I remove the main tuning slide of the tuba, place the nozzle into mouthpipe receiver and run hot water full blast through the mouthpipe for about 60 seconds. During this process, sometimes with some assistance from my wife, wiggle the valves. I then place the tuba on its bell and repeat running hot water reversely down through and out the mouthpipe. After completing this I have to take a few minutes to remove all the slides and empty out water. On piston valve instruments, I will take each piston out and run warm water over to make sure there is no gunk in the valve while using a soft brush. I can usually clean out about three tubas in about an hour using this process.

I have successfully done this with all different kinds of tubas with different finishes. This is the best way for me to clean out gunk that builds up usually once every 2-3 months. This may be too much information but it is quite easy.

[UncleBeer]

One caveat I'm not seeing mentioned here: I only see mention of "hot" water. Some types of lacquer don't like "hot" (ie: hotter than your skin likes) water, and will float off in sheets when exposed to it. Looking at you, Miraphone. Proceed with caution. My 2 cents.

[MiBrassFS]

That is very true! Or any spot that’s been touched up, too.

“We donneed no steeking lacquer…”

[bloke]

The only Miraphone lacquer I've encountered that's nitrocellulose has been on re-lacquered instruments and super old ones. I've used water up to this temperature range on the really old ones, and any lacquer that was going to come off those had already come off. The re-lacquered ones (rare...not many tubas ever ger re-lacquered) held their lacquer, unless it was one of those jobs where the lacquer dried too fast when it was applied and it was also probably also too thin (was flaking off already). Otherwise, Miraphone lacquer (70's forward) is about the toughest lacquer that I've encountered...other than maybe browning up a little bit quicker than some others when working on solder joints.

Anyway, people may have encountered different instruments of the same or different brands with lacquer in different condition and/or done during different eras, or perhaps redone. My experience is that doing this quickie type of cleaning job is easier on most any lacquer than putting it in an acid solution or in an ultrasonic tank. My usual experience has been that - when lacquer starts coming off - it wasn't in particularly good condition to begin with.
When a sax specialist friend of mine - Wil Grizzle - used to work on old Mark 6's or Kings or long-ago re-lacquered saxes or whatever - and would give their bodies an acid bath prior to repadding them (because they had disgusting "bar residue" on the outside and inside, and some old weak lacquer came off here and there), he would refer to that as "dead lacquer", because it wasn't really bonded anymore.

[MiBrassFS]

There was a brief weird period when someone retired and the FNG wasn’t up to speed that there was some questionable finishing going on, lacquer and silver, but other than that, doesn’t seem to be a big problem that I have seen. Rattle can refinish or touch up… well…

[Matt Good]

One caveat I'm not seeing mentioned here: I only see mention of "hot" water. Some types of lacquer don't like "hot" (ie: hotter than your skin likes) water, and will float off in sheets when exposed to it. Looking at you, Miraphone. Proceed with caution. My 2 cents.

Disclaimer: All I do is play the tuba. I'm not a repairman or a rocket scientist. I do take my tubas annually to Uncle Beer for a chem clean annually the past few years. I also change my own oil and do disc brake work.