Where to buy buffing wheels?

[Rick Denney]

Now that I have a work area, I’ve dredge up my bench motor, which is an old 1-hp Dayton with a 5/8” shaft and a tapered buff holder.

I know Ferree’s has buffing wheels for mounting on tapers, but their pricing is painful for that sort of consumable. I’m looking for 8” buffs—medium sewn and fine loose color buffs. The buffs I have now are fine for polishing steel but are far too hard for brass.

For the last many years, I didn’t have bench space for this bench motor, and have been using a 6” buff mounted on a drill clamped in a vise. But this motor will be so much better—1725 RPMs, and by one hp I really mean what most tool companies these days would call two hp. (Rated running amps is 15.8–1800 watts.) I think it’s got the oomph for some more serious buffing, using larger wheels.

Anyone willing to divulge their sources?

Rick “seeing only 1/2” and larger center holes on eBay and Amazon that won’t bite securely in a tapered holder” Denney

[bloke]

Buffing wheels do not need to precision fit. They are never perfectly balanced anyway. If you take a half inch hole buffing wheel and put it on a 5/8 arbor, you will just hold it in the best position while tightening down your nut and washer. If you end up with the type of buffing wheel that features a hardened center to go on an arbor, you pound of 5/8 inch hole punch through the middle, so it fits your machine.
A buffing rake is what is used to re-soften the surface and to balance a buffing wheel.
I’ve tried to find economy price buffing wheels and failed. Just pay the price or don’t get any.
What does harbor freight have?

Finally, to me bench motors are awkward for buffing, but can be handy for little pretend–lathe type of operations in order to remain seated, rather than going over to the lathe to do something simple (though though admittedly, I find a drill to be just about as handy - even sticking a drill in a vice for a minute or two… yeah: I’m a hillbilly).
Pawn shop medium size grinders convert into more usable buffers (at least, in my experience), and generic floor stands for them are not out of reach, economically.

The Getzens (Allied Supply sell nice thick center-sewn - 3/4" thick) for $13 (plus shipping).
If I were near you, I'd be glad to order some. I'm delighted when people prefer to do their own buffing.
Ferree's prices require a couple of handstands to find things on their website - and then figure out what they cost.
This pricing seems sort of amazing, but - apparently - is for hard metals and abrasive work:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/144391977215

[the elephant]

https://caswellplating.com/spiral-sewn- ... eel-8.html

[Rick Denney]

I’ve tried to to find a pawn shop or yard-sale grinder around here that isn’t just like the three I already have, and I can stall those with a four-inch buff. I have just tried to bring one of those back by putting new bearings in it. It’s supposedly an 8” grinder. The “3/4 hp” motor pulls one-third the current of this “1 hp” industrial motor. Even with a 6” wire brush wheel I can stall this cheapie grinder with the tip of a screwdriver and not much force.

Good industrial grinders are scarce as hens teeth in these parts. And I already own this motor. Of course, I could always mount it on a pedestal if I wanted to. I already have a grinder on one.

Then there’s the speed issue. Rikon sells a medium-power bench grinder that turns at 1725, and I have both a Delta and a Craftsman variable-speed grinder. Turned down, neither of them have much power. But most cheapies turn at 3450–too fast.

Ferree’s buffers all have those tapered spindles (their pic):



I have that on the motor. Super easy to change buffs in literally a few seconds, and I can have half a dozen of them charged with different compounds. I just can’t find 8” buffing wheels with the usual 1/8” center hole that work best on it in any selection or at a reasonable price.

Edit: Yes, those wheels on eBay are for polishing industrial machine parts, apparently. I have a couple of those for polishing steel, but they are pretty crappy even for that. The buffs you describe at Allied sound like the ones at Caswell that Wade linked. I just thought they would not work on a tapered spindle—center hole too big.

Rick “who has some cheapie buffs that shred on first use” Denney

[Rick Denney]

https://caswellplating.com/spiral-sewn- ... eel-8.html

Thanks, Wade. I had seen those, but was put off by the 1/2” arbor hole, which I think is designed for a nut-and-washer arbor. Do you have a tapered spindle? Have you tried these on it? My spindle’s taper goes up to at least 3/4”, but probably closer to 7/8”, but I wonder if the arbor holes in these are tough enough for a tapered spindle.

I guess I should buy one and try it.

Rick “looking for a shaft-mounted chuck, too” Denney

[the elephant]

@Rick Denney You can select the hole size. It is a "radio button" menu item. 5/8" is one of the sizes they offer.

[bloke]

For the small stuff (where I use converted grinders) I just remove the pieces that fit around the wheels, so I can stick any size buffing wheel where the 6 inch grinding stones were.
If you judge that 3250 is a bit too fast, you can just use 6 inch wheels.
Otherwise, you might want to weld yourself together an honest-to-goodness buffing machine.

Gravity tension is just fine for the drive belt, and it’s probably (??) about the safest type of tension as well. I made mine to have adjustable height, but I just leave it at one height which is comfortable. Mrs. bloke doesn’t complain about the position when she uses it. She actually likes the B.A.M. for buffing woodwind keys, because she likes to get them done quick, and she knows what she’s doing.
me…?? When I buff small stuff I use 1750 and half horse. There is one converted fractional horse machine which is 3250 (and a fine machine) but I don’t visit it very often. (There’s also a three-phase that runs at about 2800 or so, and it tends to sit as well, unless I’m using the huge grinder on the other side of it.)

Another reason I don’t like bench motor buffing (other than having a stationary object taking up bench space) is because it gets that crap all over all of my other stuff… and there’s nothing worse than for a ridiculously horrible mess to be covered with buffing dirt.

[the elephant]

I use a 6" Baldor 111 buffer with a 1/2" shaft. I wish I had an 8" one for the longer arbors. It is hard to buff out tuba stuff when you are right up on the machine. It prevents you from reaching a lot of stuff, and this is what a bench motor buffer will get you. So look at fabbing up a dedicated stand you can take out to the driveway to fling all the crap into the neighbor's flowerbed along your fence.

I now have a 4" extension on the lefthand arbor and a small grinding stone on the right. The weights balance pretty well, and I can change over to an unstitched flannel wheel for color buffing on those rare occasions when I intend to lacquer something. I do not want my buffer bolted down as you can use way too much pressure like that. Anyway, with the stand loose from the cement, there were vibration issues with an arbor extension on just one side, and the second extension has something wrong with it, so I don't trust it. The addition of the stone to the right side took away the vibrations and it once again runs super-smoothly.

The Baldor is great, but only a third of a horse is stuffed into the little case. (I don't know which third, but I suspect it is not the part with muscles.) I love it, though. It has allowed me to do a lot of things I was unable to do a few years ago. I have it mounted on a small grinder floor stand.



I used to *try* to use the orange, gutless Harbor Freight motor but gave up and bought the Baldor shortly after the orange disaster started F-ing up on me.


I have three Dayton bench motors, one of which is actually a functioning bench motor. I am building out a small lathe and the other will become the motor for it as the HP, RPM, and continuous duty numbers all work out to be what I need. The third one is part of a nice, homemade table saw built from some nicely restored, antique table saw components. It is one of those belt-driven saws where the motor is on a hinge, and its weight serves as its own belt tensioner. I need to photograph that motor so I can run the numbers. (A deceased neighbor made this saw and gave it to me a few years before he passed on. he did a great job, too.)

The quarter horse is my mounted bench motor. It has a Jacobs chuck on one end and a tapered spindle on the other with a stitched leather buff on it that must be 40 years old. (It was on there when I bought the motor years ago. Oddly, it came from an automotive shop, but it has an old Ferree's sticker on it!)





This one will be my lathe motor. It is set up in a mounding rack and has a double pulley on one end and nothing out the other, so my gravity tensioner on that old saw could be stolen for use on the lathe.



I also have this silly 2" (or 3", depending on what size buffs are for sale when I need a bag) air die grinder set up as a mini-hand-held buffer, and it actually works *very* well in certain circumstances. I run it from my little 20-gallon DeWalt compressor. To use it for a big project makes me pine for an 80-gallon compressor, though. If you are set up for gobs of air, this could be a very nice buffer for small areas. You can find cheap Ryobi stitched cotton and loose flannel wheels at big box places that will fit this; just make sure to use good tripoli and rouge.



If your motor happens to have a hollow spindle as mine does, you can remove the tapered shaft, add a chuck, and be able to spin long rods that will come out the back of the motor, which can be a *very* handy feature to have.

[Rick Denney]

[mention]Rick Denney[/mention] You can select the hole size. It is a "radio button" menu item. 5/8" is one of the sizes they offer.

Yes, I see that, but nothing smaller than 1/2”. These are designed to slip over a shaft and be clamped under washers and a nut. The wheels Ferree’s sells for tapered spindles has a 1/8” arbor hole. That used to be the only kind you could get from them as I recall.

Rick “may be behind the times” Denney

[Rick Denney]

For the small stuff (where I use converted grinders) I just remove the pieces that fit around the wheels, so I can stick any size buffing wheel where the 6 inch grinding stones were.
If you judge that 3250 is a bit too fast, you can just use 6 inch wheels.
Otherwise, you might want to weld yourself together an honest-to-goodness buffing machine.

Gravity tension is just fine for the drive belt, and it’s probably (??) about the safest type of tension as well. I made mine to have adjustable height, but I just leave it at one height which is comfortable. Mrs. bloke doesn’t complain about the position when she uses it. She actually likes the B.A.M. for buffing woodwind keys, because she likes to get them done quick, and she knows what she’s doing.
me…?? When I buff small stuff I use 1750 and half horse. There is one converted fractional horse machine which is 3250 (and a fine machine) but I don’t visit it very often. [emoji52] (There’s also a three-phase that runs at about 2800 or so, and it tends to sit as well, unless I’m using the huge grinder on the other side of it.)

Another reason I don’t like bench motor buffing (other than having a stationary object taking up bench space) is because it gets that crap all over all of my other stuff… and there’s nothing worse than for a ridiculously horrible mess to be covered with buffing dirt.

Your last point is compelling—but I don’t feel it necessary to mount a bench motor actually on a bench. :)

Rick “thinking this motor would make a good belt-driven buffer, but takes up too much space for how often I would use it” Denney

[Rick Denney]

Off to a social thing but I’ll post pictures later tonight.

Rick “the rolling cart is an excellent idea” Denney

[bloke]

Our first fractional horse belt driven machine was something that someone stuck together with nails and two by fours. I should junk it, but I hate to take something apart that still works, even though I never use it. The point is that you could make something pretty darn good without spending very much money.
I’ll take a picture of that embarrassing old piece of $h!t, if you are curious to see what someone did.
If you are suggesting that something not fastened down hard would serve as a good buffing station, I’m scratching my head.

[Rick Denney]

The rolling cart would not be a light little thing.

Here’s the motor I’m using:





I’ve just pulled it apart to service it and it’s all good. Minimal bearing wear with no sign of extended dry running, and I’ve just re-oiled the packing material with the prescribed 150 drops of 20-wt in each bearing. I’ve had this thing sitting under a pile forever, having bought it at a flea market in Dallas.

Here’s what it replaces:



I can stall this with a screwdriver tip on that wheel. It’s not as powerful as the ancient 1/3 hp Craftsman variable speed grinder that I can’t use for buffing because of the integral shrouds. This will be someone else’s garage-sale find. I just put $25 in bearings in the thing, so I’m already behind.

Right now, I clamp this to the edge of a bench using Jorgensen clamps. The bench top is a layer of 2x4’s with a 1-1/4” laboratory bench top salvaged from Oak Ridge National Labs. Joe, I picked up this bench top on the way back from Cookeville, from my buddy in Knoxville.

Still wondering who sells buffing wheels for those tapered spindles.

Wade, yes, I use these, too:





…but more for die-grinding hard metals with carbide burrs.

Rick “49-year-old motorhome restoration requires this stuff even without brass” Denney

[bloke]

What are you buffing that you think pressing it against a buffing wheel on a motor sitting on a cart with wheels won’t cause the cart to turn?

All of my buffing machines are fastened down, even the pansy ones. Not only would enough pressure to polish a trombone bell tip them or push them around, but there’s also gyroscopic force that could get out of control. Without good contact and constant friction between a buffing wheel and the item being polished, the buffing will tend to dance across the surface, and even possibly jerk that thing out of the person’s hand.
I also couldn’t imagine having my workbench (where I do a lot of pushing against things) being on wheels.
I’ve never fastened my Ferree’s dent machine - an opposing example - to the floor, because - if I have to pull things through a dent ironing machine with enough force to move it on the floor - LOL – I’m going to do a great deal of damage to the thing that I’m trying to repair.

There’s a saying about other people’s things, and other people’s decisions with their stuff:
“ ‘ ain’t mine.”

… anyway, you’ve been shown that – just as I’ve found from shopping around – that there really aren’t any bargain buffing wheels, and everyone charges just about the same when you compare diameter, how many plies, style, and what type of material. The good news is that typical 8 inch spiral-sewn buffs - that are used for soft metals - last a fairly long time. I don’t come anywhere close to using one up (or rather a pair of them sitting side-by-side) – when buffing out a tuba. I don’t even knock them down to 7 inches.

I have bought some of the Getzens’ used flannel buffs for color buffing. I don’t need those to be 8 inches, and the price is right. I don’t think they’re doing repairs there anymore, so I guess they are just those that are used to polish the Getzwards instruments.

[Rick Denney]

I ended up moving away from tapered spindles, much though I love the idea of them. I just can’t find buffs for them anywhere.

Caswell has extension shafts for 5/8” shafts that take buffs with 1/2” arbor holes, and I bought two of those, plus a couple of spiral-sewn buffs and a couple of loose flannel buffs. I’ll just keep the Allen key handy. I prefer the tapered spindle, but it is what it is.

The wheels I have for the tapered spindle are for polishing steel—sisal, dense spiral-sewn, and loose cotton with compounds I’d never use for soft metals.

Rick “polishes steel blades routinely” Denney

[bloke]

Well, the Getzen’s buffs that they resell are designed for tapered shafts (again, when I sometimes buy from them, I pound the middle out of them with a hole punch), but again I would have to have them shipped here and then re-ship them to you, unless you wanted to join NAPBIRT or something (and I’ve never joined that myself… just not much of a joiner type of person).

… so you’re not looking to polish brass?
Maybe those five-dollar hard-metals spiral-sewn buffs that I found on eBay would appeal to you then.

[tofu]

.

[Rick Denney]

Well, the Getzen’s buffs that they resell are designed for tapered shafts (again, when I sometimes buy from them, I pound the middle out of them with a hole punch), but again I would have to have them shipped here and then re-ship them to you, unless you wanted to join NAPBIRT or something (and I’ve never joined that myself… just not much of a joiner type of person).

… so you’re not looking to polish brass?
Maybe those five-dollar hard-metals spiral-sewn buffs that I found on eBay would appeal to you then.

I know I can get the cheapies for polishing steel, and I have some of those. I was using the just last night to polish the sharpened area of some axes I just rehafted. But I was targeting brass and silver for these.

Next time you order some from the Getzens, give me a shout and I’ll add to your order.

Rick “and, yes, I had to vacuum up a mess” Denney

[bloke]

Postage and/or shipping has gotten sky high on anything of any size/weight at all. This probably won’t work out, but driving up to the Sheboygan area in August, and I’m making a huge loop to the west to avoid Chicago and Milwaukee. Maybe I’ll be close enough to Elkhorn to stop by and pick up some stuff…?? I’m not sure.
—————
Edit:
I just remembered that my brother will be there too, and he will be driving. As you know, he lives close to you. I have no idea if this will work out but I could buy some wheels on the way up and hand them off to my brother. That would eliminate both the expensive shipping to me and the expensive shipping from me to you, as the Getzen’s are only willing to ship to their own customers.

[Rick Denney]

That would work fine. Thanks!

I wonder where the Getzens get them? Prolly some wholesale special order.

Rick “thinking my motor could probably handle 10-inch wheels, too” Denney