Kanstul?

[Grumpikins]

Im just curious. Does anyone here know the story behind kanstul closing up shop?

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[DonO.]

I don’t know a lot but I do know some.

Zig Kanstul, the eponymous founder of the company, died in 2016 at the age of 87. The company was largely personality driven. Without “the man, the myth, the legend”, it was difficult to keep going. They finally announced they would no longer be making instruments in 2019. The Kanstul web site is still up and in their closing statement they state that the site will remain up for the foreseeable future for reference purposes only. Mighty nice of them, don’t know who would be paying that bill. The reason for closing in the statement is vague. Business no longer sustainable or words to that effect. This is just speculation, but I suspect the usual culprits in any business’s demise- rising costs of material, labor, shipping, and so forth. Of course, California is a very expensive place to do business, especially manufacturing, so that didn’t help matters. If they had chosen a lower-cost location, maybe things would have been different.

It is a well known fact that B.A.C., a well known maker of custom brass instruments in Kansas City, bought parts and tooling from them. For a short while, folks were hopeful they would revive the Kanstul name and products, at least some of them. But that was not to be. Rumor has it that they are using the tooling to make at least some of their custom trumpets.

When rumors were going around about their demise in 2018-2019, some were saying online that they would be re-vamping their business model by dropping “background brass”- tubas and euphoniums of course- but obviously that never happened.

[LargeTuba]

They didn’t know that they didn’t own the building when Zig died, so it was a big shock when they were told they were behind on payments. A couple of other bad business decisions was all it took for it to go under.

[bort2.0]

They didn’t know that they didn’t own the building when Zig died, so it was a big shock when they were told they were behind on payments. A couple of other bad business decisions was all it took for it to go under.

Ouch.

[York-aholic]

Back when Zig was still with us, Kanstul pretty much had the market on G bugles for Drum Corps. When the rules changed to allow BBb horns, there was the likes of King and Yamaha competing for that market. That had to have hurt quite a bit.

[JRaymo]

Lee Stofer had a kanstul 66T when I was visiting. I was offered to try it out. I liked that tuba quite a bit. Sad they are no longer being made.


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[bort2.0]

The tubas the Kanstul got right, they really nailed it. The one Kanstul 90 CC that I've played was a really nice tuba.

The tubas that they didn't make very many of -- like the largest CC -- were all over the place. It's been described to me by several big name tuba people/sellers/repairmen as the opposite of the B&S PT-6... which has had decades of refinement and standardization of parts and R&D. That big CC was a little different for every individual instance... Some were great, some weren't. They just didnt have the volume to get it right consistently.

Plus, tubas are expensive to make, and a small part of their sales. Frankly, I think we're lucky we got anything at all from them.

[Finetales]

Speaking of the G bugles, that's the one Kanstul line that BAC has recently restarted production of. It's been very streamlined (4 models instead of 10) and the prices are almost twice as high as Kanstul was selling them for, but they exist and the USMC drum and bugle corps replaced their Kanstuls with them.

[bone-a-phone]

To add to the story above, which rings true to what I've heard, the family played a role in shutting down. After Zig's passing, some of the family members wanted to get their portion of the company value (which if they didn't own the building and they didn't sell the company, couldn't have been much), which resulted in closing it down. They did have a big sale of existing stock, which offered opportunities to get some rare stuff that wasn't going to be found any longer. The Mike Sluter bass, and some 88h-ish horns with TIS were probably fantastic players and highly collectible.

They made bones in the style of Williams, Conn, Bach and others. I'm not sure about other types of brass instruments, but it wouldn't shock me if they had followed that pattern in other instruments.

I bought my bass bone directly from Kanstul probably 4 years before they closed, and was able to talk with them about how I wanted it set up. I chose bell material and gauge, slide width, etc. They were almost a custom shop, but they charged low prices for their horns. I only paid ~$3800 for a double valve horn, when most of those from other makers were ~1000-4000 more.

They offered some odd trombones including several tuning-in-slide (which mine is) basses and tenors. They were the only maker to offer a plugin valve for a single bass (Yamaha has a disassemblable second valve on the 622/822, but it's not really a plugin valve). Some of these must have been really low-volume items.

Zig worked for Olds, King/Benge and Conn. He started Kanstul in 1981, and there are still a lot of brass musicians who have never heard of the name, as it was probably best known for marching equipment.

A portion of the company website is still up. https://www.kanstul.com/about/about-kanstul/

[Grumpikins]

I just want add a kudos to Lee Stofer for building tubas. Thank you. Your my hero.

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[TNID]

I had the opportunity to meet Zig’s son Jack for a tour of the Anaheim factory back in 2016. He was really excited about the progress they were making with their tubas. They had a small F tuba and a 3/4 CC that were both a lot of fun and played quite well. The larger “Grand” tubas had a really great sound but took a fair amount of work to play.

The impression I got was that they had reasonably strong export sales to China (of all places) but things were not as strong here in the States. I was disappointed to see the company go.

[aarongsmith]

Speaking of the G bugles, that's the one Kanstul line that BAC has recently restarted production of. It's been very streamlined (4 models instead of 10) and the prices are almost twice as high as Kanstul was selling them for, but they exist and the USMC drum and bugle corps replaced their Kanstuls with them.

BAC shipped the mandrels to China to have a factory over there build the horns, I'm not certain but I believe it was Jin Bao. Since they were a sole source the band commander was able to get an exemption from the Buy American Act. I believe that BAC ended up sending a lot of the Kanstul mandrels there to get their import model made.

[LargeTuba]

All the tuba making parts can be yours for the low low price of $400,000.

They didn’t make the one model of tuba that everyone wants and everyone’s buys. They also made their valves weird, which I’m sure scared off buyers.

[Finetales]

BAC shipped the mandrels to China to have a factory over there build the horns, I'm not certain but I believe it was Jin Bao. Since they were a sole source the band commander was able to get an exemption from the Buy American Act. I believe that BAC ended up sending a lot of the Kanstul mandrels there to get their import model made.

And yet they still charge twice as much as Kanstul did. Can't say I'm surprised.

[bort2.0]

All the tuba making parts can be yours for the low low price of $400,000.

They didn’t make the one model of tuba that everyone wants and everyone’s buys. They also made their valves weird, which I’m sure scared off buyers.

At least out east, they were virtually non-existent.

It wasn't until just a few months ago that I finally got to try one out, and it was the first one I had ever seen in person.

[LeMark]

I played one of the Eb's at TMEA years ago. I really wanted to like it, but it slotted extra wide and was tricky to play in tune

[York-aholic]

Speaking of the G bugles, that's the one Kanstul line that BAC has recently restarted production of. It's been very streamlined (4 models instead of 10) and the prices are almost twice as high as Kanstul was selling them for, but they exist and the USMC drum and bugle corps replaced their Kanstuls with them.

BAC shipped the mandrels to China to have a factory over there build the horns, I'm not certain but I believe it was Jin Bao. Since they were a sole source the band commander was able to get an exemption from the Buy American Act. I believe that BAC ended up sending a lot of the Kanstul mandrels there to get their import model made.

Boo!