Wife rescued this from an auction somewhere in Ohio. Guessing it did time in a school, based on the names scratched into the bell lacquer.
Appears to be a 1968 (Lxxxxx s/n) 30J (3-valves, not short-action)
We dropped it off at one of our local repair shops that's friendly to "project" horns. They have it a once-over but unfortunately say that they can't do anything for us due to lack of availability of valves (presumably from Conn).
Is this piece destined for the parts shelf, or wall-art? It's got the usual abundance of dents, but doesn't seem to be *that* bad - probably budget-restoration worthy if the valves can be sorted out first.
Hmm.. .good question. As best as I can tell, the ports are round, not oval, so not short-action. (Judging by looking at the tubing on the outside of the casing, and sticking my finger in the casing... my borescope doesn't do right-angles...)
I thought the 20J's were all short-action?
Not really sure how we came up with that it's a 30J - extrapolated from some catalog I found online somehwere at some point :) Entirely OK if I extrapolated incorrectly.
24" bell, if it matters... Any other possible identifiers I should be looking for?
travisd wrote: ↑Fri Sep 08, 2023 9:49 am
Hmm.. .good question. As best as I can tell, the ports are round, not oval, so not short-action. (Judging by looking at the tubing on the outside of the casing, and sticking my finger in the casing... my borescope doesn't do right-angles...)
I thought the 20J's were all short-action?
Not really sure how we came up with that it's a 30J - extrapolated from some catalog I found online somehwere at some point :) Entirely OK if I extrapolated incorrectly.
24" bell, if it matters... Any other possible identifiers I should be looking for?
Yes, the 30J is the "long-action" variant of the 20J, same 6/4-sized body. I always thought the 30J was prevalant pre-War. All 20Js are short action, you're correct.
Are the bottom valve caps "Coke bottlecap" style? Got a pic of 'em? If so, that would mean it is a 20J and has short action valves.
arpthark wrote: ↑Fri Sep 08, 2023 9:52 am
Are the bottom valve caps "Coke bottlecap" style? Got a pic of 'em? If so, that would mean it is a 20J and has short action valves.
Smooth caps.
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Those pistons are no longer available new...and you probably know this.
The front-action (sousaphone) versions cost dealers upwards of $300 each (unless there has been a price increase in the last year...??)
The jobber (re-wholeseller) price is about $450.
I just saw that some online place (that sells mouthpieces and other things) is retailing them for well over $5XX each. but all of this is a non sequitur, as the sousaphone ones don't work in the top-action/short-action tubas.
Checking a 4-year-old catalog (I didn't go online to their most-updated catalog and prices)...
The same jobber has (had...??) #2 pistons (ONLY) for the 20J tubas for around $100...but NEITHER #1 nor #3...
The piston accessories (cap components/stem components, button, etc.) can still be obtained, though it's become very difficult (though American-made just about as difficult to obtain as if made in Asia).
They also had some #4's - which you do not need.
I just perused eBay for you, and found no 20J pistons for sale.
I myself (occurring to my while posting) have a 50-year-old Besson three-valve top-action COMPENSATING (1-3 and 1-2-3 intonation is automatically corrected) valve section which I suppose I could sell...(??)
I have no idea how difficult it might be to paste onto a 20J, but it IS (at least) top-action.
The primary bore of the Besson valveset is .728" and the compensating side (4th valve pitches) bore is nearly the same as your Conn -
- Besson 4th valve/compensating bore - .768" (19.5mm)
- Conn 20J valve section bore (all) - .773" (99/128")
I would have to come up with a price...OK...I guess (on the fly) WERE IT THAT the jobber (re-wholeseller) had all three pistons (which they do NOT - and NEVER will again), a repair shop were VERY nice to you, sold them at cost, and you ALSO had to buy all of those cap/stem/button parts - plus shipping, I would estimate that imaginary price to be about $450...
...If you wanted to play around with the Besson 3-valve compensating valveset, I'd offer it for $300 plus shipping.
(HOWEVER, I would STRONGLY encourage you to - rather than buying ANYTHING - let that instrument serve as "decor".)
Last edited by bloke on Fri Sep 08, 2023 10:19 am, edited 1 time in total.
If you are fascinated with the idea of owning/playing a big old "6/4"-size American-made recording bass, find a 3-valve MARTIN Mammoth (same huge size as that Conn) for sale - that has good valves an is in working order (for an affordable price).
Those are easier to play in tune than the Conn 20J's (sorry, Conn-lovers), produce a gorgeous sound, and are tons of fun to play.
Thanks, I don't think there's any particular fascination with a BA Recording Bell Tuba here - we'll likely stick it in a stand and let it keep watch over the collection of other slightly more play-able relics up in the tuba room. Wife was willing to go to about $1500 to get it back into "playable" condition, but not likely to happen unless we get really lucky and stumble across valves.
I don't think I'm ready yet to attempt a franken-tuba, though this might be the one that would make sense to do so.
Now I'm curious if the bell will fit the 70s/80's(?) King fiberglass sousa that's also part of the stable. (Said Sousa has a perfectly good fiberglass bell already, but some shiny brass wouldn't be a bad option to have...
Dents Be Gone! wrote: ↑Fri Sep 08, 2023 10:37 am
Brother, she’s a keeper!
Assuming you mean the Wife, absolutely! To be clear, she plays too, and is the one who's usually bringing home another well-loved horn to add to the 'collection'. I tend to hard-pass on anything that doesn't come with working valves...
