Removing the dents

[Paulver]

This question is for "bloke"..... and/or any other repairmen who might read this.

My newly acquired 1930's sousaphone has a broken solder joint at the bottom of the main bow. There are several dents, dings, and scratches all along the outer run of the bugle from the bell housing to the beginning of the valve assembly. Nothing major, except for the loose joint and the dent right on it. My question is this....... Being that the main solder joint is already loose, there are only two more solder joints and one brace along the inner loop holding the two halves of the horn together. If my repair guy would separate the two remaining joints and that single brace, the horn could be quickly taken apart, allowing him to completely remove all of the dents in both halves, very easily. It would also make for much easier removal of all tarnish and get a good cleaning.

My gut feeling is to split the horn into two pieces and get everything attended to and fixed. Then put it back together. In my mind, that would be the best, easiest, and quickest way to get everything accomplished..... saving a ton of repair time costs.

That being said, I'm not an instrument repairman. Am I not seeing or understanding something here? It just seems like a simpler way to get everything done without undue work and time.

I don't know how this thing plays yet, and as a result, I don't know if I'll keep it, sell it, or whatever. If upon getting it repaired, I find that I like it, then I'll keep it and use it, which would definitely make the repairs worthwhile.

Looking for info and opinions on it.

[bloke]

I’m a little bit sick today and I only glanced at some of the words in your post, but I have pulled sousaphones and apart into two halves quite a few times - in order to fix dents, but I mostly use magnet techniques these days (when not doing complete restorations), and sometimes even peel back guard ribs to remove dents and then solder them back down in place.
Just in case this response was nonsense - due to not completely reading your post, I’ll come back later and read your post more carefully.

[Mary Ann]

I hope you remain only a little bit sick and it doesn't escalate into That Thing.

[bloke]

...so yeah...
It appears that my response makes enough sense.
I'm still not averse to un-soldering sousaphone bodies "in half"...
...particularly if they are really deeply dented, someone wishes to have a "really good" dent removal job done (though NOT restoration-priced) and if it's (unlike sousaphones made in the USA in the last three decades or so) fabricated of substantially thick sheet metal.
I cannot do (even) that level of dent-removal work in the summer, as I'm trying to wade through endless scores of large brass instrument repairs.

I hope you remain only a little bit sick and it doesn't escalate into That Thing.

broke out in hives last night...along with headache, stomach ache, slightly sore throat.

There's an armyworms plague, in this region.
Mrs. bloke found them in an isolated part of the property, and I wiped them out with malathion.
The reaction occurred about one-and-and-half days later.
The hives only lasted for an hour, and (though miserable) I actually continued to work through them (as my "employer" doesn't offer any "sick leave").

I felt weakened, today, but delivered a mountain of nicely-repaired instruments to four schools - during their band camps.
Though there are a few add-ons, I'm seeing less than a dozen (though a couple are "involved") school instruments remaining out in the shop, as of today.
The coffee and aspirin (aka: "analog B.C.") is wearing off quickly, so I'm going to go (as it's nearly time for Svengoulie (the original House on Haunted Hill), and I'm quite tired) lay down.

Oh yeah...Many of you might be interested to know:
I wore one of those "approved" masks...You know: the ones - mandated in various predictable types of places - that are said to stop "droplets"

[York-aholic]

Malathion is some nasty stuff. My wife was a medic before crossing over to ER nurse.

She had a patient who tried to end it all by drinking a quart of the stuff. It worked. But while my wife was trying to keep said person alive, the ‘body’ sweated enough of the stuff out that my wife had a serious enough exposure that she remained at the hospital when the delivered the ‘patient’ in the ambulance. The rig had to have a full in depot level cleaning.

Wife’s opinion is that malathion poisoning isn’t a pleasant way to go…

Wishing you a speedy recovery from whatever ails you.

[Yorkboy]

Hoping you mend quickly, B.

Maybe you’re having a reaction to the malathion?

[bloke]

The weirdness is receding.
The next time I use it, I’m going to use something other than a bullsh!t/Dumbo‘s-feather/calm-the-masses-and-give-them-a-false-sense-of-security “mask”, and pull out one of my “real” chemical respirators - and maybe a crappy old plastic poncho, too.
Yesterday, I didn’t exactly work my butt off, but I did completely load and unload my full-size work-van with heavy instruments…totally to the gills (bottom to top/front to back), and drove several hundred miles delivering all that mess. ...again: My “medications“ (isn’t that the word that millennials-and-beyond like to use?) were coffee and aspirin.
Technically, I guess they would be labeled as “therapeutics“.
Again: My job doesn’t have any “sick days” built into it.

[Yorkboy]

Coffee + aspirin = Excedrin (?)

You probably sweated out the toxins while exerting yourself.

[bloke]

Yes. Perspiring is above normal, and I consider that to be a good thing that is happening.
In the south, there has always been a product which consists of powdered aspirin and caffeine call “BC”. It preceded Excedrin.
All southern convenience stores sell it.

Coffee + aspirin = Excedrin (?)

You probably sweated out the toxins while exerting yourself.

[The Big Ben]

I've heard about it but never seen it. It is mixed with water, isn't it? Wonder what would happen if you mixed it in a cup of hot coffee? (Headache gone and running around on the walls).

[Yorkboy]

I’m gonna pick some up next time I’m down your way.

[bloke]

"about" back to 100%...
' will spray glyphosate, today, which never seems to bother me at all.

"EEK, bloke," you say..."Stay AWAY from that stuff !!! "

--------------------------------------

OK...I'll go back inside my enclosed workrooms, and inhale acid fumes, paint fumes, and buffing compound.

[bloke]

DENT REMOVAL: ...general comments on the topic

Dent removal is a craft, NOT an art, because the repairing person did not create the CRAFTED instrument in the first place.
That having been said... Typically the CRAFTsmen who manufacture instruments are afforded the use of a great deal more specialized tooling than are repair CRAFTsmen, so the repair-person (perhaps...??) has to employ a TINY-TINY amount of "art" in their work, as their job often more resembles working with modeling clay, than it does working with machinery. Eyes MUST constantly scrutinize the results (BOTH with manufacturing and repair), but when something is (mostly) being repaired "free-handed" the eye is the ONLY thing serving as any sort of (using the table saw vernacular) "fence".

[Yorkboy]

DENT REMOVAL: ...general comments on the topic

Dent removal is a craft, NOT an art, because the repairing person did not create the CRAFTED instrument in the first place.
That having been said... Typically the CRAFTsmen who manufacture instruments are afforded the use of a great deal more specialized tooling than are repair CRAFTsmen, so the repair-person (perhaps...??) has to employ a TINY-TINY amount of "art" in their work, as their job often more resembles working with modeling clay, than it does working with machinery. Eyes MUST constantly scrutinize the results (BOTH with manufacturing and repair), but when something is (mostly) being repaired "free-handed" the eye is the ONLY thing serving as any sort of (using the table saw vernacular) "fence".

I’m not sure whether I agree with you or not.

You’ve gotta have a pretty damned good eye (and sense of touch and feel as well) to smooth out dents in an agreeable fashion…..I think it goes a bit beyond craft, IMHO, as does really high quality auto body work (both are so similar, to my mind).

[bloke]

My craft simply involves trying to trace - what someone else originally did - to the best of my ability. Even people who copy the masters - who painted great art works - are considered to be craftsman.

I have a pretty restrictive definition of “art”.
In music, most of what we hear and are hired to play is basically what popular musicians call “cover band“ work. Even when bands go around performing their own recordings, they’re basically acting as their own cover bands. Nearly all symphony orchestra playing is “cover band“ work. When people applying for symphony orchestra jobs deviate very much at all from recordings during their interviews (auditions), they are dismissed.
...so what is “high art music”...??

Probably this: